"Hip Hop is a black thing, we just let yall in"

[Flipmo]

Rap music is black. They started the genre. Do they decide what hot? Not anymore. The masses who buy the product decide. The billboard charts decide. The videoclips decide.

One thing is certain, rap music is food for the soul when it comes to african-americans. When this music was created it was not only for entertainment value, it was to help uplift a ppl who'd gone through slavery, and was still opressed and/or was just to get your point of view across.

Whites are allowed to be into any aspect of hiphop. They've been more welcome now than ever. Your shit is dope and you're standing up for a real good reason, you'll get nothing but respect. Noticed mostly that graf and b-boys have the least racial tension between em. This only goes on in Mcs.

Whatever it is though, in the end we're all still human, we all suffer the same way; dead of a close one, drugs, and general pain. The hate still goes on against black and whites just because of a couple shades of color. Sadly, you can never lose hate. Ying-yang, theres always gonna be hate within love and love within hate.

Bottom line is as a social norm when it comes to rap music: Blacks created it the music, just respect the founders and shut the fuck up.

Very simple, no?

 

[Pittsey]

If you want to be smart why didn't you say names (in response to the Jamaican DJ comment)? To be honest his Jamaican roots had more to do with the hip-hop culture we know but that can be said about too many infleunces.

You should say black Americans, unless you want to be stupidly precise and single out several DJ's, several reggea mc's and etc.

My comment isn't really hard to comprehend.

"Like I've said before, crediting blacks in general for hip-hop is pathetic. It's like saying some black guy in Congo has more of a connection to the culture than a white person in Canada because of his race."

Although black is black and a hip-hop is a black culture (it's roots can be traced much further as we all know) the modern combination was created IN America under American conditions.

In my opinion if you're going to credit a group of people for the modern day hip-hop culture and its basic meaning you must credit the black Americans because that's were hip-hop came into its own.

I wasn't trying to be smart. Hence my "not taking the piss" comment.

I tried to make it as clear as I could. I know that you can't tell voice tone over the net, but I tried to make it clear.

And are you implying I don't know said Jamaican DJ's name?

And your point was fair. Black Americans did make hip-hop the way it is. But that's what I meant. I think we all know America started it all. And if people don't they need to read a book.


P.S - DJ Kool Herc

 

[MATW95]

American, non white, non black

Hip Hop is gonna follow the same trend that several other music genres in the past have followed. Jazz was started by blacks as was Blues. Both of these genres were started for blacks, by blacks until a few white people began noticing how moving and funky it was. The blacks doing the music wanted to get paid, like any human on the planet and allowed the white people to help promote them. Jazz and Blues eventually faded out and Rock came into effect. Rock N Roll, started by blacks for blacks as a movement (very similar to Hip Hop), appealed to white audiences very quickly and was picked up on almost instantly. For a period of time, blacks and whites both listened to Rock but began edging toward something more "hard." Now we're into the Punk movement. Blacks aren't often identified with Punk music, but should be in some cases. They didn't start the genre, but did, however, help it progress like the white people did with Blues and Jazz in the 20s and 30s. Around this time, several black youths within the inner city weren't able to afford guitars, drums, etc. and needed a type of music that they could listen to. Their problem was that they were bumpin the same stuff their parents were, and they didn't wanna be identified with them because they wanted to rebel, hormones, who knows what. Anyway, some of the inner city youths, mainly black, began digging through their parents crates and finding Jazz music. Over the Jazz saxophones and other instruments, the main person was often "rapping" with the audience. "Rapping" at this time wasn't affiliated with anything that a normal person these days would affiliate it with. Instead, it was known as a slang term used to say "lemme speak my mind with you." The only issue with Jazz music and the kids though was that it wasn't "hard" enough. So they began looking for ways to blend "rapping" and hard music with each other. Afrika Bambaata began his movement by using hard bass, power chords, and guitar riffs that were appealing to the new group of youths. They began listening to this thing called "Hip Hop" and kept moving with it. In the mean time, white kids were still bumping Punk music because it was tight. People don't know that the Punk and Hip Hop movements were almost together because they were spreading almost the same message: we're not happy with the way we youths are being treated, so listen to what we have to say or else we'll force it down your throat. Punk heads would recieve "free passes" up the southside of Brooklyn while Hip Hop heads would recieve "free passes" down at the Punk clubs. They both helped each other move and progress throughout the early 80s but were, for some reason, split because Hip Hop began being more of a voice for blacks instead of the new youth. This continued until the mid to late 90s when whites REALLY began listening to Hip Hop and understanding the message it was sending. They began bumping it just as much as the blacks were and eventually wanted to hear more of it. They began pushing units for these artists in the Hip Hop genre and record labels began seeing that they could cash in on this thing we call Hip Hop. Now, earlier I mentioned Rock N Roll, which is viewed as a white thing nowadays, correct? Well, as mentioned earlier, it was started by blacks and later by whites (Chuck Berry and Little Richard are some of the early artists that were later faded out by the likes of the Rolling Stones and Elvis). Hip Hop is beginning the move into the same direction and will, unsurprisingly, move into the hands of the white community. The argument concerning Hip Hop being for blacks and only for blacks would have been perfectly believable in 1983 and even in 1990. But now, you will see that the white-owned record labels are beginning the cash in on this culture and are also trying to push white artists to the forefront of Hip Hop (Atomsphere, Company Flow, Eminem, Paul Wall).To conclude this rather long post, I'd like to say that Hip Hop began with blacks, will move into the white community, and will force blacks to start a new genre like they had to before.

 

[MATW95]

To add to my last post, I'd like to say that the Dee jay wasn't what we call it today. The Dee jay was the person yelling into the microphone amping up the crowd while his friend, known as an emcee (odd huh?) put on the banging music. This of course was all in Jamaica and later moved to the United States when DJ Kool Herc rode around in his car with his giant speakers. People misunderstood what he told them was what and accidentally switched the names of the Dee jay and the emcee. Hip Hop's roots are in Blues, Jazz, and Jamaican music a.k.a. reggae (all started by blacks)

 

[Quasimodo]

i will say that hip-hop is an african-american art form. i am white and i thoroughly understand that. no one i've ever met has ever told me to stop rhyming because white boys aren't accepted or because its a black art form. in the south, things just don't go like that. a lot of people here don't find it a problem when a white boy (knowing his background) says "nigga", there are no problems with that.

i think black folks should take credit for the invention of hip-hop. i just hate the fact that there is all of this racism, even in today's society. we need to come together and get past that. we know how things originated, but cultures change, and they diversify. hip-hop is being spread throughout the world and its getting bigger than anyone ever imagined. i don't understand the ignorance of some people!

 

[linx]

Like I've said before, crediting "blacks" for hip-hop is pathetic. It's like saying some black guy in Congo has more of a connection to the culture than a white person in Canada because of race.

That's what i'm saying. :\

*waits to get hate*

 

[linx]

Bottom line is as a social norm when it comes to rap music: Blacks created it the music, just respect the founders and shut the fuck up.

Very simple, no?

I don't think people are denying that african american people created the music, they are just disagreeing with all the other bullshit being said. There's no fucking question about it that the music started out black, but it has changed. And honestly, would you not say it has changed for the better? It's WORLD WIDE now and that won't change any time soon. It won't die down. I would never deny that it started out a black thing, but like I said, it evolved. So it's NO LONGER just a black thing. For someone who loves the music as much as me, it's hard to just sit back and listen to people say it's a black thing and that's it, period.

It's just like anything else that has evolved in my opinion. It's no longer the same. The past definitely cannot be changed and it shouldn't be. But for anyone to say that hiphop is still just a black thing, I don't get it and I definitely don't agree. The world is a funny place. People struggle period. Not just certain people. There are plenty of white people that can relate to shitloads of rap records about struggle and shit like that. Music is something people should enjoy, period. I couldn't possibly begin to express how much I enjoy hiphop music. I love it more than anything else, literally.

If you ask me, this thread got to racial. There was really no need to get into half of the shit some people got into. I've always thought I was a unique type person because of the way I thought and many other things. I don't know how many people would agree with me, but I am looking at this whole "hiphop being a black thing" the way I would look at some other things. First off, I disagree with looking at groups as a whole. For instance, if a black person does something bad, I hate seeing people looking at the whole black race for it. I know you might think this has nothing to do with the thread, but let me continue..

Some people have said it's a black thing because black people can relate to eachother, because they struggle and because what they have went through. Obviously the past is in the past and today, people struggle period. It's not just something black people can relate to. It's something white people, asian people, hispanic people and all kinds of other people can relate to. Not to mention, it's not all about struggle anymore like it was when it started. Grandmaster Flash's "The Message" was a real song and it was reality. Now music isn't all about stuff you can relate to. You still have serious-reality type music you can relate to, but you also have the party music, the whacky music and all kinds of other shit. And as far as the culture as a whole goes, it's the same way. Not everyone that listens to hiphop music will get into the culture, but it's the same way. You'll still have the white kids who listen to rock music that will call white people who listen to hiphop music wiggers, but who really gives a fuck. Either they are too dumb to realize obvious shit or they just cannot comprehend shit like I have said. :thumb:

 

[Devious]

I wann't going to get involved in this discussion, but I've been thinking about it a lot since last night. I think the reason some blacks are so protective when it comes to hip-hop being a black thing is that naturally, they fear whites will end up dominating it and people will forget the roots of where it came from, just like with rock and roll. However I see a big difference between rock and rap. See, when rock first started and was still dominated by black people, it hadn't been fully established as a legitimate form of music in the mainstream. But when white people got involved it took off and the mainstream finally started accepting it. The difference with rap is that it has been established in the mainstream for years as a predominantly black art form, before whites started to become REALLY successful in it. I truly believe that even if whites completely take it over, it will still be remembered in 50 years from now because of the originators, unlike rock, where most people nowadays don't even remember that it was black music. I feel though that music is music and if you feel it, it doesn't matter what the color of your skin is, as long as you show respect for the originators.

 

[two187pac]

This was posted on okayplayer quite a while ago but I still think the discussion created will interest us for a week or so. Do you remember this, roaches?

How would you respond to the man that wrote this? What would you say?

American White Men: Does this annoy you or do you agree with the point?

American Black Men: Do you feel this way? If not, why?

Non-American Citizens: ???

im an american white male and to an extent i agree with some of the statement but disagree with most of it. the majority of artist are black but i wouldnt say that you guys determine whats hot and whats not. i dont know if your realizing this but the people buying all these albums and putting money in the rappers pockets are mostly white highschool kids. im not saying blacks owe whites anything im just saying what determines whats hot is record sales , and if the whites are buying most of the albums then what does that say. last time i checked to the biggest selling rapper last year was a white guy. thats like saying golf is a white mans sport, im sure tiger woods would disagree.

 

[KAMIKAZI]

If Hip Hop is strictly for black people, then the telephone and many other technological breakthroughs invented by white people are ours! I'm sure a white person invented the microphone, so if it wasn't for us you'd be fucked! :thumb:

 

[linx]

^ lmao, that was just wrong.

 

[two187pac]

how was that just wrong? the basis of the arguement is basicly that they invented it and we are trying to hop on the bandwagon so using that logic that means all the things invented by whites should only be used by whites and all the things invented by blacks should be used only by blacks. so that would mean no lightbulbs for blacks and no open heart surgery for whites...... pretty stupid when u look at it from any point of view other then music but whatever i guess.

 

[Devious]

^^^The thing is that nobody's saying only black people can make or listen to rap music, even the person who wrote the article wasn't saying that, so that analogy is wrong

 

[KAMIKAZI]

^^^The thing is that nobody's saying only black people can make or listen to rap music, even the person who wrote the article wasn't saying that, so that analogy is wrong

Well, then light bulbs are a white thing, we just let y'all in! :thumb:

 

[L.O.G.O.S.]

i basically think with any music form you can trace it back to its roots and say "such and such can claim to own ITS ROOTS/ORIGINS" but thats about it....

the second you put out music to the masses it changes, and diversifies and like someone else said white people have been rapping from pretty much the start...

a long story short people can claim to be "the founders" of a music genre (eg certain styles of classical music being from central/eastern europe", but they cant claim to own it outright....

Alexander Graham Bell invented the phone, and he gets credit for it, but im sure he wouldnt be around here claiming that any further advancement in that technology (eg cell phones) is his as well...

and so it is in rap and hiphop....the music has evolved to a point where its even being split by religion (www.muslimAC.com). you ahve wrestlers rapping, sports stars, rock stars, even the occasional politician....its hit everywhere and its gone beyond what it would have if it were to have been a "black thing"...

certain aspects are more strongly affiliated with the black culture admittedly, but hiphop and rap in its current state and form goes far beyond race, religion, etc, as its been taken up by so many different fractions around the world...

"pop" music was predominantly a "white thing" then you have MJ as the "Prince of Pop" and he was black (you know what I mean)...why people get so protective over something like this is beyond me...

im an Iranian Muslim living in the UK and the fact of the matter is im more closely linked to hiphop than the majority of black people out there....for someone to say that your skin colour can determine what is and isnt yours (even in a context such as this one) is border line racism, or a subtle form of prejudice...

black people might have started it up but things change...

peace

 

[marc]

^^ im sorry but bell did not invent the phone first. it was invented by a german teacher - Phillip Reis - in 1861 (15 before bell's patent). not a good example.
i didnt want to be a smartass but basically thats the point. people fear that their culture/invention is annihilated by others and nobody will remember them as the originators... but its been said before


ps: in other countries hiphop is not as "black" as it is in the u.s. so what would that mean for those countries? no russian or scandinavian rappers ?(are there any? lol)
or why should they prop black people? perhaps their content is totally different to the u.s.`?

 

[Preach]

black people might have started it up but things change...

and therefore you're supposed to not give them credit where credit is due?

i agree with most of what rukas and roaches have said. it's a black thing that we can all enjoy, but we SHOULD respect the.. i'm gonna hate myself for saying this, "race" that invented it. without black people, hiphop wouldn't exist. that's the truth.

 

[Preach]

ps: in other countries hiphop is not as "black" as it is in the u.s. so what would that mean for those countries? no russian or scandinavian rappers ?(are there any? lol)
or why should they prop black people? perhaps their content is totally different to the u.s.`?

there are tons upon tons.

why should they prop black people? lol.. whether you're from finland or indonesia, rap originated in the united states, and furthermore came to be because of african-americans.

 

[KAMIKAZI]

without black people, hiphop wouldn't exist. that's the truth.

True, but white people pitched in by discovering electricity! :thumb:

 

[ARon]

^
And black people pitched in by being the first humans, stfu about the white man invented this and that shit, it is entirely irrelevant. No one said white people can't lsiten to rap and it is only for blacks. How you came up with that i'll never know.