"Hip Hop is a black thing, we just let yall in"
- Thread starter Bill G
- Start date
Yes I'll admit that black ppl were the innovaters but doesn't mean that they are the only one keeping the legacy alive.
anyways its annoying and very racist when I hear that its a black thing and only they can get credit and should listen to it I hear it all the time but they should embrace the fact that ppl are feeling their music internationally I remember when they used to say that ppl were always critizing it a lot and they would be angry now that ppl feel it they saying its not the right ppl who are. I mean its like you cat have your cake and eat it too.
anyways I don't agree with it black,white whatnot I still listen to it i aknowledge they created it but everyone else kept it alive so in general whether I get beat up,critized or whatnot for listening to it I don't care I like it and no race or rule will change my listening to it.
anyways its annoying and very racist when I hear that its a black thing and only they can get credit and should listen to it I hear it all the time but they should embrace the fact that ppl are feeling their music internationally I remember when they used to say that ppl were always critizing it a lot and they would be angry now that ppl feel it they saying its not the right ppl who are. I mean its like you cat have your cake and eat it too.
anyways I don't agree with it black,white whatnot I still listen to it i aknowledge they created it but everyone else kept it alive so in general whether I get beat up,critized or whatnot for listening to it I don't care I like it and no race or rule will change my listening to it.
i gave them credit where it was due....i said they can claim to be the founders didnt i? i agreed that they invented it...beyond that what do you want me to do? thank god there are black people every time i listen to tupac?
and its stupid to say without black people hiphop wouldnt exist...if you want to be cynical you can say it was the oppression of the whites that started it, or go another step back and start "thanking" slavery while youre at it, or lets go another step back and thank a flawed democratic system and peoples prejudices while we're at it...hell lets thank England for inventing English, and trace the whole thing back to the big bang....
despite my extreme sarcasm above, i give credit where its due and as i said, they can claim to be the "inventors"...
and Marc: stop being petty and realise that what i said was in principal...you basically either completely failed to comprehend my point or indeed you ARE a smartass, i dont personally care either way...
all these people talking about how much extra credit they deserve are talking as if its some life saving discovery...im sure white people ahve done a hell of a lot musically, and on far more important matters like medicine, healthcare, education etc...
to me its pathetic that people are so hung up on having this as some sort of "identity" that its called a "black thing". Originally it may, like i said, have been invented by black people, but that was literally decades ago now...its time to move on and accept the fact that its international...
take a look at Kanye West for example...he samples from "white" music all the time, but you dont see anyone whining that they dont get credit for it do you?
i dont see black people out there crusading to save hiphop which is commercially decaying into nothing....infact an increasing porportion of ill underground heads who are keeping things on track are very white...
break it down like this:
Define what hiphop is.
Grandmaster Flash's definition:
When I laid this foundation down.. the key was we could take almost anything musically just as long as it had a beat to it.. so that the rhymer who flowed over the top of it could syncopate.. For anybody to say that whatever they're doing in Florida is not hip hop..or whatever they're saying in LA is not hip hop.. Who are these people to say that?.. There were songs that Bambaataa played that to this day I still don't know.. They were so funky.. Some of the ones I got the priviledge to know..I was suprised...You take a song like 'Apache' for example which was considered to be one of the hip hop main themes..Those were a bunch of white guys.. The Incredible Bongo Rock Band were white guys.. There was one person there who was Black.. He was King Erickson who was a percussionist...
For anybody to say 'this is not hip hop' or 'that is not hip hop' is wrong. That is not the way the formula was laid down.. It was for the people who were going to continue this to take anything...by all means necessary and string it along...
Or as Afriak Bambaata puts it:
Hip Hop means the whole culture of the movement.. when you talk about rap..Rap is part of the hip hop culture..The emceeing..The djaying is part of the hip hop culture. The dressing the languages are all part of the hip hop culture.The break dancing the b-boys, b-girls ..how you act, walk, look, talk are all part of hip hop culture.. and the music is colorless.. Hip Hop music is made from Black, brown, yellow, red, white.. whatever music that gives you the grunt.. that funk.. that groove or that beat.. It's all part of hip hop....
Are artist from the West Coast and Miami
considered Hip Hop?
Too Short, E-40 all the brothers and sisters that are making that hip hop and coming from the funk part of it are all hip hoppers.. The Electro Funk which is that Planet Rock sound which is now considered the Miami Bass sound is also hip hop.. The GoGo sound that you hear from Washington DC is also hip hop.. New Jack Swing that Teddy Riley is R&B and hip hop mixed together...So hip hop has progressed into different sounds and different avenues.. People also have to recognize from hip hop music..inparticular the electro funk came House music and Freestyle music with a lot of our Pueto Rican hip hoppers...
The freestyle music really comes from Planet Rock..If you look at all the freestyle records its based upon Planet Rock.. If you look at all the Miami Bass records it's based upon Planet Rock.. It's all based upon electro funk... which came from hip hop music... Hip Hop has experimented with a lot of different styles of music and there's a lot of people who have brought different changes over time with hip hop.. which have brought out all these funky records which everybody just started jumpin' on like a catch phrase.. For example when 'Planet Rock' came out you had all of the electro funk records.. When you had Doug E Fresh with the show and 'La Di Da Di'.. a lot of rappers went that way...When Eric B came out with 'I Know U Got Soul'... all the way up to Run DMC and Wu-Tang. All these people brought changes within hip hop music... Unfortunately today a lot of the people who created hip hop..meaning the Black and Latinos do not control it no more...
does that answer your question?? have i given credit where its due? blacks invented it, but now they have very little claim to it in its current form...
peace
and its stupid to say without black people hiphop wouldnt exist...if you want to be cynical you can say it was the oppression of the whites that started it, or go another step back and start "thanking" slavery while youre at it, or lets go another step back and thank a flawed democratic system and peoples prejudices while we're at it...hell lets thank England for inventing English, and trace the whole thing back to the big bang....
despite my extreme sarcasm above, i give credit where its due and as i said, they can claim to be the "inventors"...
and Marc: stop being petty and realise that what i said was in principal...you basically either completely failed to comprehend my point or indeed you ARE a smartass, i dont personally care either way...
all these people talking about how much extra credit they deserve are talking as if its some life saving discovery...im sure white people ahve done a hell of a lot musically, and on far more important matters like medicine, healthcare, education etc...
to me its pathetic that people are so hung up on having this as some sort of "identity" that its called a "black thing". Originally it may, like i said, have been invented by black people, but that was literally decades ago now...its time to move on and accept the fact that its international...
take a look at Kanye West for example...he samples from "white" music all the time, but you dont see anyone whining that they dont get credit for it do you?
i dont see black people out there crusading to save hiphop which is commercially decaying into nothing....infact an increasing porportion of ill underground heads who are keeping things on track are very white...
break it down like this:
Define what hiphop is.
Grandmaster Flash's definition:
When I laid this foundation down.. the key was we could take almost anything musically just as long as it had a beat to it.. so that the rhymer who flowed over the top of it could syncopate.. For anybody to say that whatever they're doing in Florida is not hip hop..or whatever they're saying in LA is not hip hop.. Who are these people to say that?.. There were songs that Bambaataa played that to this day I still don't know.. They were so funky.. Some of the ones I got the priviledge to know..I was suprised...You take a song like 'Apache' for example which was considered to be one of the hip hop main themes..Those were a bunch of white guys.. The Incredible Bongo Rock Band were white guys.. There was one person there who was Black.. He was King Erickson who was a percussionist...
For anybody to say 'this is not hip hop' or 'that is not hip hop' is wrong. That is not the way the formula was laid down.. It was for the people who were going to continue this to take anything...by all means necessary and string it along...
Or as Afriak Bambaata puts it:
Hip Hop means the whole culture of the movement.. when you talk about rap..Rap is part of the hip hop culture..The emceeing..The djaying is part of the hip hop culture. The dressing the languages are all part of the hip hop culture.The break dancing the b-boys, b-girls ..how you act, walk, look, talk are all part of hip hop culture.. and the music is colorless.. Hip Hop music is made from Black, brown, yellow, red, white.. whatever music that gives you the grunt.. that funk.. that groove or that beat.. It's all part of hip hop....
Are artist from the West Coast and Miami
considered Hip Hop?
Too Short, E-40 all the brothers and sisters that are making that hip hop and coming from the funk part of it are all hip hoppers.. The Electro Funk which is that Planet Rock sound which is now considered the Miami Bass sound is also hip hop.. The GoGo sound that you hear from Washington DC is also hip hop.. New Jack Swing that Teddy Riley is R&B and hip hop mixed together...So hip hop has progressed into different sounds and different avenues.. People also have to recognize from hip hop music..inparticular the electro funk came House music and Freestyle music with a lot of our Pueto Rican hip hoppers...
The freestyle music really comes from Planet Rock..If you look at all the freestyle records its based upon Planet Rock.. If you look at all the Miami Bass records it's based upon Planet Rock.. It's all based upon electro funk... which came from hip hop music... Hip Hop has experimented with a lot of different styles of music and there's a lot of people who have brought different changes over time with hip hop.. which have brought out all these funky records which everybody just started jumpin' on like a catch phrase.. For example when 'Planet Rock' came out you had all of the electro funk records.. When you had Doug E Fresh with the show and 'La Di Da Di'.. a lot of rappers went that way...When Eric B came out with 'I Know U Got Soul'... all the way up to Run DMC and Wu-Tang. All these people brought changes within hip hop music... Unfortunately today a lot of the people who created hip hop..meaning the Black and Latinos do not control it no more...
does that answer your question?? have i given credit where its due? blacks invented it, but now they have very little claim to it in its current form...
peace
Hopefully this will shut up the nay sayers: (article by NyceStylez)...
People seem to attribute Hip-Hop's success among the masses due to the assumed fact that Hip-Hop is black culture. It's a mistake that I can understand, since most of the faces one sees involved in Hip-Hop seem to be of African-American descent. But then again, when you watch the television, you don't see much Hip-Hop, or even rap. Only BET and MTV will play rap videos, and it's not like they've got real Hip-Hop on these two channels twenty-four- seven. So, when the casual observer walks along the "Rap/Hip-Hop/R&B" section of their local branch of Camelot, Sam Goody, or K-Mart, all they seem to see are black faces. Therefore, it's only natural for the casual observer to think that Hip-Hop is black culture.
I'm here today to challenge this myth. And that's precisely what it is: a false myth. Sure, most of the exposed rap artists and emcees out there are African-American, but what about the DJs? What about the graff writers out there? What about the b-boys and b-girls out there? What about all the people who respect the culture and follow it and love it? What about the people who contribute to Hip-Hop magazines and newsletters? What about all the people who read that damn shit? If one could count all those people, one could easily see that Hip-Hop isn't black culture. Rather, Hip-Hop is a part of black culture and Hop's universal, dammit! It's fuckin' universal because members of practically every society out there's rockin' to this shit!! I wouldn't be surprised if some X-Files case out in the cosmos is listening to some Invisible Skratch Piklz right now.
It didn't start out as black culture, either, because Hip-Hop has always been its own culture. Let me say that shit again, just in case you didn't catch that. Hip-Hop has always been its own culture. Not all of the fathers and godfathers of Hip-Hop were African-American. The original breakers were black and hispanic. The first graff writer, Taki, was Greek. Speaking of graff, Seen isn't black. I could go on and on, but it would be quite long and boring, so I'll just stop here with my point that Hip-Hop was composed of different races, different ethnic groups, different styles, and different cultures. Hip-Hop still is composed of all these things, as well as different age groups, different nationalities, and straight up different people.
So can you see why people into Hip-Hop aren't "acting black"? Can you see why people need to know the truth rather than spread the myth? African- American culture is different from Hip-Hop, although the two do have a relation. Asian-American culture is different from Hip-Hop, although the two do have a relation. Hispanic-American culture.... etc. You know what I'm trying to say. Hip-Hop is its own culture, so don't mix it with any other. Peace to all my Hip-Hop brothers and sisters. Support Hip-Hop unity.
People seem to attribute Hip-Hop's success among the masses due to the assumed fact that Hip-Hop is black culture. It's a mistake that I can understand, since most of the faces one sees involved in Hip-Hop seem to be of African-American descent. But then again, when you watch the television, you don't see much Hip-Hop, or even rap. Only BET and MTV will play rap videos, and it's not like they've got real Hip-Hop on these two channels twenty-four- seven. So, when the casual observer walks along the "Rap/Hip-Hop/R&B" section of their local branch of Camelot, Sam Goody, or K-Mart, all they seem to see are black faces. Therefore, it's only natural for the casual observer to think that Hip-Hop is black culture.
I'm here today to challenge this myth. And that's precisely what it is: a false myth. Sure, most of the exposed rap artists and emcees out there are African-American, but what about the DJs? What about the graff writers out there? What about the b-boys and b-girls out there? What about all the people who respect the culture and follow it and love it? What about the people who contribute to Hip-Hop magazines and newsletters? What about all the people who read that damn shit? If one could count all those people, one could easily see that Hip-Hop isn't black culture. Rather, Hip-Hop is a part of black culture and Hop's universal, dammit! It's fuckin' universal because members of practically every society out there's rockin' to this shit!! I wouldn't be surprised if some X-Files case out in the cosmos is listening to some Invisible Skratch Piklz right now.
It didn't start out as black culture, either, because Hip-Hop has always been its own culture. Let me say that shit again, just in case you didn't catch that. Hip-Hop has always been its own culture. Not all of the fathers and godfathers of Hip-Hop were African-American. The original breakers were black and hispanic. The first graff writer, Taki, was Greek. Speaking of graff, Seen isn't black. I could go on and on, but it would be quite long and boring, so I'll just stop here with my point that Hip-Hop was composed of different races, different ethnic groups, different styles, and different cultures. Hip-Hop still is composed of all these things, as well as different age groups, different nationalities, and straight up different people.
So can you see why people into Hip-Hop aren't "acting black"? Can you see why people need to know the truth rather than spread the myth? African- American culture is different from Hip-Hop, although the two do have a relation. Asian-American culture is different from Hip-Hop, although the two do have a relation. Hispanic-American culture.... etc. You know what I'm trying to say. Hip-Hop is its own culture, so don't mix it with any other. Peace to all my Hip-Hop brothers and sisters. Support Hip-Hop unity.
you might want to check out these letters and responses too:
http://www.daveyd.com/marchletters.html
peace
http://www.daveyd.com/marchletters.html
peace
from what you said about "things change" you made it sound as if you could thank white people for todays hiphop. you're right, things change. i didn't say you didn't give credit where credit is due, i wasn't really replying to you, just saying in general.
anyway, them shits you posted were good. i liked what grandmaster flash said in particular. i dunno where i'm going with this, but you sounded like you felt the need to defend yourself and i kinda just wanted to say don't bother lol. i think this discussion hit a loop point, or a dead point if you wish.
anyway, them shits you posted were good. i liked what grandmaster flash said in particular. i dunno where i'm going with this, but you sounded like you felt the need to defend yourself and i kinda just wanted to say don't bother lol. i think this discussion hit a loop point, or a dead point if you wish.
Your forgetting history. Back in the day Blacks wernt allowed in the League at all no matter how good they were, because Whites decided who's in and who's out. It's only when that barrier finally came down that Blacks where accepted into the game. I'm sure it was as blatant at the time as this comment we're talking about.
Ofcourse what happened in the past effects what happens today, to say otherwise is being blind. You have no idea how a person who's entire family history was filled with oppression and racism feels about that today.
I think anyone who listens and loves Hip Hop should gain the knowledge that this was an artform created by mostly African Americans. You have to give respect to that you dont have to get on your knee's and kiss someones feet but just give it up for the creators of what you love, otherwise its like being religous but not loving God. I dont hold the opinion non-Blacks cant include themselves in rap but they should show that respect.
I dont think Blacks decide whats hot these days, especially in the mainstream. I think theres a wider audience that buys the cd's. But when you think about it, what race are the majority of rappers?
Ofcourse what happened in the past effects what happens today, to say otherwise is being blind. You have no idea how a person who's entire family history was filled with oppression and racism feels about that today.
I think anyone who listens and loves Hip Hop should gain the knowledge that this was an artform created by mostly African Americans. You have to give respect to that you dont have to get on your knee's and kiss someones feet but just give it up for the creators of what you love, otherwise its like being religous but not loving God. I dont hold the opinion non-Blacks cant include themselves in rap but they should show that respect.
I dont think Blacks decide whats hot these days, especially in the mainstream. I think theres a wider audience that buys the cd's. But when you think about it, what race are the majority of rappers?
I'd most definitely thank the actual originators, but should I just go around thanking all the black people I see? I mean come on, really. If a group of white kids start hitting balls with sticks and it eventually grows to be a game that all kinds of people play, am I gonna look back and think about the originators or am I gonna wanna think every white person I see walk by me in the street?
the problem is that i do need do defend myself damn near constantly from people who dont know what hiphop is or where it came from...
Theres a chance I might even be signing for Universal soon as a lyricist/producer and ive been doing this for almost a decade...
but because i dont fit a certain race, or background, or dont appear to be this and that, im told im "not hiphop" quite often...i dont "dress right", i dont "talk right" im not "ghetto enough", im not "black enough"...etc etc etc...
i get tired of it because i thank the people who founded hiphop based on what they did and i dont gave a damn what their skin colour is....if most of the old school rappers who founded it were white, and black rappers were in the minority do you think i would care? obviously not...
So there you have it...i love hiphop, and no offence to people up on here in paritcular but youre ignorant if you believe "hiphop is a black thing, we just let yall in"...
peace
:thumb:
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