Film & TV Lost Season 4 Discussion

[Preach]

------------SPOILER----------------











i watched the episode again. the sand around jacob's house actually draws a clear line as if to confine something. almost like voodoo. i read something somewhere about someone using circles of salt to confine spells and magic. i'm thinking saruman's hold over king theoden in lord of the rings. jacob wants locke to help him because ben is keeping him trapped, and when ben couldn't hear what jacob said to locke, he felt threatened. that's why he shot him.

i want to know for sure what ben's role with the others are. because his flashbacks show richard was there before ben, and was the one who let ben join the others. why would ben be his leader? or maybe the others choose the most "special" person in their group as the leader. ben brought locke to jacob as a test. he meant to piss locke off. we know ben manipulate people into thinking it's their idea. he wants locke to not believe, because if he believes there's a greater chance he might see or hear jacob. because if he could, that would mean he was special, and ben's leadership over the others would be challenged.

i don't get why being the leader means so much to him though. what are they doing on that island?! maybe they are trying to control the visions and powers. maybe ben thinks he can find his mother or something. this episode shows why he's obsessed with fertility studies and pregnant women dying.

 

[Illuminattile]

i watched the episode again. the sand around jacob's house actually draws a clear line as if to confine something. almost like voodoo. i read something somewhere about someone using circles of salt to confine spells and magic. i'm thinking saruman's hold over king theoden in lord of the rings. jacob wants locke to help him because ben is keeping him trapped, and when ben couldn't hear what jacob said to locke, he felt threatened. that's why he shot him.

The voodoo/magic thing seems to make sense, since Jacob appears to be some kind of poltergeist or something.

i want to know for sure what ben's role with the others are. because his flashbacks show richard was there before ben, and was the one who let ben join the others. why would ben be his leader? or maybe the others choose the most "special" person in their group as the leader. ben brought locke to jacob as a test. he meant to piss locke off. we know ben manipulate people into thinking it's their idea. he wants locke to not believe, because if he believes there's a greater chance he might see or hear jacob. because if he could, that would mean he was special, and ben's leadership over the others would be challenged.

Richard knows Ben saw his mother, maybe that implied something about Ben?

What I want to know is, does Richard have anti-aging powers or does he just look REALLY good for his age? If not, his character is like 20 years older than the actor.

And if he does have powers, and is "special", why isn't he leader?

And if he's "special", what's the big deal about Locke?

And why does he let Ben lie about being born on the island, when he knows (from talking to young Ben about his mother) that he wasn't?

And what happened to Annie? Is she dead? Or does Annie = Dannielle?

Something that someone brought up, that I didn't even notice, is that Ben shot Locke in the kidney area. Locke doesn't have both kidneys, his father took one. Has that saved Locke's life?

*EDIT* didn't notice all the previous comments

Sounded like Ron Perlman to me, the guy from Hellboy.

Apparently Jacob's voice was done by Carlton Cuse. Looked like Locke in a silly wig, to me.

 

[Preach]

What I want to know is, does Richard have anti-aging powers or does he just look REALLY good for his age? If not, his character is like 20 years older than the actor.

And if he does have powers, and is "special", why isn't he leader?

will touch on the Richard being special part later, but about his age. From the Lost Experience we learned that the Hanso Foundation were working on a life-extension project that seemed to bear fruits. now Richard doesn't seem to have anything to do with Dharma by the looks of it. But he did have a company called Mittelos Bioscience whose main head quarters was everything but peanuts. "Mittelos," by the way, is an anagram for "Lost Time." i see so many parallels and connections. i think there is something about the island and aging, but i don't think it's very universal.

And if he's "special", what's the big deal about Locke?

i dunno if by "he" you are still referring to Richard, or to Locke, but either way, i think the big deal about Locke is just what Richard said. if someone was able to heal instantly like that, they had to be very special. and Ben said Locke had some sort of communion with the island that was new to him, which made him very important. probably part of a longer con that included getting his spirit up to break it down to keep his hands tied so to speak. so as to not be a threat to Ben. to be able to really make an educated guess, we'd have to know more about what being special or having a communion with the island means. we'd also need to know more about the island's properties.

And why does he let Ben lie about being born on the island, when he knows (from talking to young Ben about his mother) that he wasn't?

this is one question that i consider part of a greater question which you touched on earlier. why is ben the leader? it makes no sense. if only Ben talks to Jacob, is that why he is the leader? maybe Jacob was to the natives like Jesus to christians or something, and Ben was the only one able to bring his spirit back or communicate with him somehow. i am still amused by that ring of dust that is obviously confining or keeping something out.



------------SPOILER--------------




the producers said that jacob's significance to the story can be compared to the emperor's significance to the star wars series. in the old movies you are lead to believe vader is the main villain, and the emperor is only rarely mentioned, then by the third movie you realize he is the main villain. and by the end of the three new star wars movies you see that the emperor actually orchestrated EVERYTHING to get in charge. quite interesting. now of ben and jacob, who is the emperor and who is vader? jacob seems like the obvious emperor, but ben is the one who had a bunch of people who wanted harmony and worked for the better of mankind (parallel: the jedi) killed for his own good. if ben is the one keeping jacob in that house or somehow controls him or manipulates him, that also puts him in the emperor role more than the vader role. i know btw, i am reading it way to literally.

And what happened to Annie? Is she dead? Or does Annie = Dannielle?

annie will return at an unknown future time. apparently, the events that took place in episode 20 are only a taste of the things to come, relative to ben's flashbacks and the purge. i don't think there's much more to learn or see about the purge itself, but i believe in time we'll learn more about things that happened at that point in time.

Apparently Jacob's voice was done by Carlton Cuse. Looked like Locke in a silly wig, to me.

i thought it looked like that old guy from the Blade movies.

 

[k69atie]

isn't lost going to be on until 2010?

It is a load of shit - you watch it for all that time - and nothing has happened yet!

*yawns*

 

[Illuminattile]

will touch on the Richard being special part later, but about his age. From the Lost Experience we learned that the Hanso Foundation were working on a life-extension project that seemed to bear fruits. now Richard doesn't seem to have anything to do with Dharma by the looks of it. But he did have a company called Mittelos Bioscience whose main head quarters was everything but peanuts. "Mittelos," by the way, is an anagram for "Lost Time." i see so many parallels and connections. i think there is something about the island and aging, but i don't think it's very universal.

It'll be interesting to see if any of the other Hostiles are still around, or if (as Ben claimed) everyone else was brought there by him.

this is one question that i consider part of a greater question which you touched on earlier. why is ben the leader? it makes no sense. if only Ben talks to Jacob, is that why he is the leader? maybe Jacob was to the natives like Jesus to christians or something, and Ben was the only one able to bring his spirit back or communicate with him somehow. i am still amused by that ring of dust that is obviously confining or keeping something out.

My theory is that Ben's leadership has to do with the time he saw his mother in the woods. Richard was surprised by that, and obviously (at some unseen point of time) decided to let Ben join the Hostiles and live.

I think that Jacob is dead, but is kept in that house as a ghost by the voodoo powder stuff. Richard brought Ben over to the Hostiles because he thought he might be able to see/contact Jacob - after all, he had seen his dead mother. Richard obviously needed something from Jacob, and Ben was the only way that he could get it. Maybe Jacob was the leader of the Hostiles, maybe the Hostiles came to the island to find him. Hell, maybe he's a pirate who came to the island on the Black Rock and Richard wants to find his buried treasure.

Anyway, at some point Ben realised that he was in charge and he used Jacob to get his own way. I think the whole fertility experiment thing is Ben's personal plan, because of what happened with his mother. However, now that someone else has come to the island with powers (Locke) I think Richard wants to replace Ben with him. The fact that Locke could hear Jacob (and Ben couldn't, at that point) worried Ben because he feared that he might get replaced.


------------SPOILER--------------

annie will return at an unknown future time. apparently, the events that took place in episode 20 are only a taste of the things to come, relative to ben's flashbacks and the purge. i don't think there's much more to learn or see about the purge itself, but i believe in time we'll learn more about things that happened at that point in time.

I realised how ridiculous the Danielle idea was as soon as I posted (Rousseau is French, not blonde, looks nothing like Annie etc.). Kate does look like Annie, but she wouldn't have been born when Ben came to the island.

I just get the feeling someone will pull out that wooden Ben doll at some point, and we'll go "Ooh shit, that's Annie!". Who out of the current bunch of characters could possibly do that, I don't know. Maybe Annie had a sex change, put on some weight and changed her name to "Tom".

i thought it looked like that old guy from the Blade movies.

Looking at pictures of Cuse, I think it may have been him in the chair too. May just have been a stand-in for that brief shot, since there's not too much point casting an actor to play someone who has one line and is barely seen.

 

[Preach]

isn't lost going to be on until 2010?

It is a load of shit - you watch it for all that time - and nothing has happened yet!

*yawns*

aye, three more seasons of 16 episodes. 48 episodes total, equal to 2x 24-episode seasons. personally, i sort of agree with you katie. in the first half of season 3, things were very slow. but i don't get what you mean when you say that nothing happens. i am almost tempted to make like some sort of walkthrough for season 3. i think you are looking for the wrong things lol. it's like how one person can look at something and see hope where another sees failure or something. i thinking you're not watching it right or something like that lol. maybe you missed a few things. i also think it's possible maybe you don't remember a whole lot from seasons 1 and 2? because towards the end of season 3 i am sensing that we are getting answers we have been asking for a long time. like why ethan kidnapped claire and why they wanted to cut the baby out of her. but you have to remember that with lost, if you miss just ONE episode, you miss a LOT. the show is so fucking good that the only reasonable explanation i can come up with is what i said, that you either missed out on something or aren't watching it right. i just think it's that good





SPOILER




so get this. the game changer that has been promised all season is coming in the finale, and it will happen in one of the flashbacks (?), which belong to jack. the gamechanger will be served to us purposely with the intention of blowing our minds. meaning that in time it's probably gonna be explainable and feasible, but when you see it, it is crafted to make you go "wtf?". apparently, people are gonna have a hard time imagining where the show is gonna go next season.

 

[k69atie]

Lol i just mean how long has it been and no one has found them? And why is that bloke still so fat when he has been stuck there for how long?

I have only watched one episode and it bored me to tears.

 

[Rukas]

Lol i just mean how long has it been and no one has found them? And why is that bloke still so fat when he has been stuck there for how long?

I have only watched one episode and it bored me to tears.

They've been there for 80 days or so. How much weight could you lose in that time? Regardless, they do have food.

It probably bored you because you just dont "get" it.

 

[k69atie]

Lol it's just rubbish i really can't get into it.

They probably don't have as much food as he is used to eeating - he is huge!

 

[Rukas]

Lol it's just rubbish i really can't get into it.

They probably don't have as much food as he is used to eeating - he is huge!

You do realize he is just an actor right? His weight ads NOTHING to the story, this isnt Survivor.

Like I said, you probably dont understand it. You really cant get into Lost unless youve seen it from the start and you "get" it.

 

[k69atie]

Lol i know that!

I just can't get into it - i havr tried to watch a few times and it just bores me.

 

[Rukas]

... I understand that, you said it three times. It bores you, and Im saying, thats not because its boring, if it was boring it wouldnt be so popular and make so much money for the networks. You get bored because you dont "get" it.

 

[Preach]

edit: fuck this post, i realized it was stupid.

anyway. they haven't been saved because they are not on a normal island. you can't just travel there and leave. we don't know how it works yet, but some people seem to not be able to leave the island as if it was protected by some shield. there's a little science fiction stuff in the show too. throughout season one you learn that they are stuck on an island, but you also learn that there are already people already living there. they are not all one group of people, it seems a lot more has happened on the island than what it would seem from the beginning. the first season focuses a lot on getting to know the cast. when you get to the second season the shows mythology becomes deeper. i suggest just buy or loan or download the first and second seasons and watch them.

 

[k69atie]

... I understand that, you said it three times. It bores you, and Im saying, thats not because its boring, if it was boring it wouldnt be so popular and make so much money for the networks. You get bored because you dont "get" it.

It bores me cos it is shit.

I know several people who feel the same. I do "get it" i am not thick.

 

[Preach]

It bores me cos it is shit.

I know several people who feel the same. I do "get it" i am not thick.

i believe there are two different type of people. there are the people that think a lot. these people normally become emos, hippies, social outcasts, drug fiends, commit suicide, struggle with mental issues for their entire life, and so forth. to various degrees and extents. these are the type of people who take an interest in philosophy. these are the type of people who love to quarrel on messageboards. the other kind is people who seem to not have that deeper level of intellect. they can be smarter than one of these so called "thinkers" but these are the people who normally chase careers, who normally have a lot of energy and the type of people who could have a policy about hanging with people who do drugs. these are the type of people who become police officers and these are the type of people who live a good, healthy life. i believe the two different types of people percept lost very differently. you strike me as of the latter. now don't get hung up in one particular thing i said, im just connecting dots for you to give you a perspective of the difference i am talking about. i know you're quite liberal on drugs

moreso, you may be a person who needs a quicker come-and-go type of entertainment. i like the fact that i am still wondering about things that i started asking about three years ago. i love how this show's mythology is so deep that you can spend hours just thinking about possible answers and you still don't feel any closer. some people like serialized dramas, some people don't.

anyway. i don't think he means you don't "get" it as in you don't understand it, but that it is natural for you to have desires when it comes to entertainment that lost doesn't fully satisfy.

the show is bomb and hella popular. that has to mean something. now i'm just talking about opinion wise here. if you look at the show from a technical point of view, it is very well executed. i wish you would watch the entire thing with an open mind and just allow yourself to get into it because it really is great. but the greatness doesn't lie in one scene, one character or one plot point. when i started watching lost i watched it as if it was real. i remember the producers said at one point that everything on the show could be explained using science. they later added a "pseudo-" to that, but to begin with i watched the show as if everything was real and possible. maybe that's why i was blown away so much. just like prisonbreak is all about those key moments where a bunch of cons are standing in a room doing something like digging a hole, then a guard comes in and you get than tension and they all look at eachother with those looks, lost is all about the WTF moments. if you can't appreciate those you can't appreciate the show, but it certainly is not shit. if anything it's just not for you. ally mcbeal was shit.

 

[k69atie]

Lol yeah ally mcbeal was shit!

 

[Preach]

anyway to move on, if katie doesnt like it she doesnt and that's that lol.


so it seems most major plot points from next episode and the finale, including the game-changing moment, are available on the internet. they are legit. i will not be reading the spoilers because for once i want to have an open mind and i want to be surprised.

not that it really matters because i never listen to it and people suck anyway and i often find that i actually think my opinions are better than others, but the gamechanger got some bad feedback. that's all i know. i will speak no more, but if it's partially what i am guessing it is, it is indeed HUGE.

 

[Rukas]

http://www.torrentspy.com/torrent/1173643/Lost_S03E21_HDTV_XViD_Caph_eztv

Torrent for ep 21.... Fucking helll... 127 Seeders / 10345 Downloaders...

 

[Preach]

yeah i'm getting it from sceneaccess.org, its done in 15 mins

 

[Preach]

omg.