Console & Gaming Thread
- Thread starter THEV1LL4N
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I keep flip-flopping on GPU. The principle of basically a Netflix of games for about $60 a year seems incredible but on the other hand, I'd hate to be rushed to finish a game within a certain time limit or risk losing it when it gets taken down. I'd be OK with buying the game, new or used, and playing it slowly, even if it costs more the more games I buy. Plus, GamePass games on their own are pretty cheap.
But then I see this about Yakuza coming to GPU, or at least a good number of titles, and it makes me rethink it. https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2021/01/19/coming-soon-xbox-game-pass-january-2021-wave-2/
I still have to try the games out to see if I'd like them but I wish MS would start gearing up to release a ton of AAA titles already and make people empty their wallets for an Xbox and GPU. I thought the Bethesda acquisition would see some benefits by now but it's been pretty tame on that front. Maybe the deal has yet to be finalized?
I know MS Studios games will be on GPU permanently but I'm mainly interested in titles I've missed like most/all of the Final Fantasy titles since FFX. Yakuza would be interesting to at least try. Some of the older ACs.
Maybe the supply issues meant fewer people were on current gen consoles and Sony and MS both are waiting until they're actually being sold to people instead of re-sold by scalpers before launching big projects. But I haven't heard of supply issues getting better since the new year. They're still sold out at big retailers and I imagine you have to be hunting, just like on launch day, for random re-stocks. I know COVID doesn't make things easier for devs to be working on future titles, either.
But then I see this about Yakuza coming to GPU, or at least a good number of titles, and it makes me rethink it. https://news.xbox.com/en-us/2021/01/19/coming-soon-xbox-game-pass-january-2021-wave-2/
I still have to try the games out to see if I'd like them but I wish MS would start gearing up to release a ton of AAA titles already and make people empty their wallets for an Xbox and GPU. I thought the Bethesda acquisition would see some benefits by now but it's been pretty tame on that front. Maybe the deal has yet to be finalized?
I know MS Studios games will be on GPU permanently but I'm mainly interested in titles I've missed like most/all of the Final Fantasy titles since FFX. Yakuza would be interesting to at least try. Some of the older ACs.
Maybe the supply issues meant fewer people were on current gen consoles and Sony and MS both are waiting until they're actually being sold to people instead of re-sold by scalpers before launching big projects. But I haven't heard of supply issues getting better since the new year. They're still sold out at big retailers and I imagine you have to be hunting, just like on launch day, for random re-stocks. I know COVID doesn't make things easier for devs to be working on future titles, either.
https://www.windowscentral.com/xbox-live-gold-just-became-worst-deal-gaming-history
You see this trash? MS basically shooting itself in the asshole.
You see this trash? MS basically shooting itself in the asshole.
And MS just reversed course and said they messed up. And they're making F2P games not require a Gold subscription.
MS definitely knew what it was doing since there are pictures of 6 month Live cards for $60 already at retailers. It wasn't a rash decision they made the night before and then admitted fault. This was carefully planned and they back off when the backlash happened.
MS definitely knew what it was doing since there are pictures of 6 month Live cards for $60 already at retailers. It wasn't a rash decision they made the night before and then admitted fault. This was carefully planned and they back off when the backlash happened.
They'll likely significantly hike up the price of Game Pass over time instead, and that's at least reasonable.
They might also start offering shittier games with Gold for good measure as a "punishment" and to maximize their profit this way instead.
The fact you have to pay such money (or even any money) for Gold has always been ridiculous in the first place. Everyone's paying big money for a service that costs Microsoft next to nothing to run. The ads in the dashboard make them many times more money than what Xbox traffic costs them. It's just something they're charging for because they can and people are willing to put up with it. They thought they can get away with making even more to maximize their profits but ran into a roadblock, and that's no biggie since the price increase was not dictated by a need to cover any increasing costs on their end. They'll happily continue charging $60 a year for something that likely costs them less than a dollar. Or any amount that people will gladly pay, as it's a charge for basically nothing + some free old games.
They might also start offering shittier games with Gold for good measure as a "punishment" and to maximize their profit this way instead.
The fact you have to pay such money (or even any money) for Gold has always been ridiculous in the first place. Everyone's paying big money for a service that costs Microsoft next to nothing to run. The ads in the dashboard make them many times more money than what Xbox traffic costs them. It's just something they're charging for because they can and people are willing to put up with it. They thought they can get away with making even more to maximize their profits but ran into a roadblock, and that's no biggie since the price increase was not dictated by a need to cover any increasing costs on their end. They'll happily continue charging $60 a year for something that likely costs them less than a dollar. Or any amount that people will gladly pay, as it's a charge for basically nothing + some free old games.
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I'd just get a 3060Ti now. It's a significantly better card, for not much more, and it's been out for two months, so while availability isn't great you're more likely to get it somewhere and it might even be now. The 3060 Ti is just a slightly cut-down 3070 for $399, while the 3060 is a lower end chip altogether for $329.
If the 3060 launch goes anywhere like it did for the other 3000 series cards, odds of getting it on release day are quite low, even if you're there the second your local retailers make it available, you're logged into your account with payment details in and practiced speed-running through the check-out process, which is what people did for the earlier launches. Not gonna lie, I got the 3080 but it was over a month after launch (went immediately out of stock at launch) and it was a fairly time consuming process involving setting up notifications on reddit and discord and failing many times until I managed to find one in stock and check out on time. Some people use bots, but they're expensive and retailers have gotten quite good at fighting against them.
There is a chance there will be more inventory at launch for the 3060, and it's also a still good card that tech reviewers largely advised against compared to the 3060 Ti, so there is a chance that the "be super-ready at launch" method might actually work.
If the 3060 launch goes anywhere like it did for the other 3000 series cards, odds of getting it on release day are quite low, even if you're there the second your local retailers make it available, you're logged into your account with payment details in and practiced speed-running through the check-out process, which is what people did for the earlier launches. Not gonna lie, I got the 3080 but it was over a month after launch (went immediately out of stock at launch) and it was a fairly time consuming process involving setting up notifications on reddit and discord and failing many times until I managed to find one in stock and check out on time. Some people use bots, but they're expensive and retailers have gotten quite good at fighting against them.
There is a chance there will be more inventory at launch for the 3060, and it's also a still good card that tech reviewers largely advised against compared to the 3060 Ti, so there is a chance that the "be super-ready at launch" method might actually work.
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Seeing the reactions on the Xbox sub, though, they were trying every which way to justify it. I can understand a price hike but at least make it gradual. Their current gen consoles aren't even seeing daylight due to scalpers and low supply and they're making big move as if the Zenimax acquisition lead to big projects for gamers and MS was trying to charge a premium for their services because of what was coming in the future. I think the Xbox had its first exclusive released this week with The Medium? And it's getting decent scores in reviews but that's still not enough to justify a price hike that big. Or one at all. Both the SX and the PS5 are relying on the previous gen games to sell; that "optimized" shit is something the knuckle-dragger fanboys fall for without realizing there still isn't anything you can play on the current gen that you can't play on the previous gen. And, of course, on PC.
If I had to get a console right now, I'd get the PS5. It'll be hypocritical of what I just said about current gen exclusive games but the library of the PS4 just trounces the One's and if I was stuck playing games from previous gen, that would be the console to get. I feel like GPU is going to go the way of Netflix in the long term. It'll be a great value early on but the quality of the new games is going to dwindle as developers either launch their own services or realize people may still outright purchase their game instead of sampling it via GPU. And I'd rather do that rather than be rushed to finish a game before it gets taken off GPU.
If I had to get a console right now, I'd get the PS5. It'll be hypocritical of what I just said about current gen exclusive games but the library of the PS4 just trounces the One's and if I was stuck playing games from previous gen, that would be the console to get. I feel like GPU is going to go the way of Netflix in the long term. It'll be a great value early on but the quality of the new games is going to dwindle as developers either launch their own services or realize people may still outright purchase their game instead of sampling it via GPU. And I'd rather do that rather than be rushed to finish a game before it gets taken off GPU.
Did you not use those bots that snag one for you? Or are they used to buy in large quantities? If you know how to use/program one, might be worth using it to get just one unit for yourself, if it's that difficult to get otherwise.
I saw a video from Austin Evans where people were camped out 48 hours prior to launch at a Microcenter for the 30 Series units last year. I don't think I'd ever do that but if those are people you're competing against, then there's no chance someone gets one not doing that method.
At that price, I'd love to. But all 3060ti cards are £400 here. The 3060 retails under £300. So it's a 25% difference.
It's for my son. And he needs to manage to his budget, so he needs to pick and choose carefully. Which is why I'm trying to help him by picking up a 3060. But.... I'm not confident. Although I did manage to grab a PS5 and could have got 5, if I'd wanted
The bots that people use are more sophisticated and under constant development, since there's been an arms race between them and the retailers. You have to pay quite a lot to use them so it wouldn't make sense to do so just to grab one console, or card, or a Ryzen CPU. Most people would use notification bots, which is what I went with. I refused to pay any middle men who profited on the situation.
I see. I didn't know they were that expensive to get a hold of. I figured it was a $50-100 script that would at least guarantee you a unit but I don't think I'd pay more than $50 to get one on launch day, if I wanted one on launch day.
In other news, Stadia shuttered its first party dev team. In typical Google fashion, Google is throwing in the towel on something it created.
In other news, Stadia shuttered its first party dev team. In typical Google fashion, Google is throwing in the towel on something it created.
I think Google knows that the only thing that could save Stadia is if it went the Netflix route, or "Microsoft GamePass without a console" route - pay $x per month, and play any games you want in your browser on your potato PC, or even just your TV. Because let's not forget that buying games in services like Stadia are a gamble that you will never recover the money you poured into it once it goes out of business, which is more likely than not. The Nvidia model is at least better in a way that they're basically renting you a high end PC remotely, to play games that you own yourself on platforms that likely won't be going away until you die. Even if Nvidia disappeared altogether, you can still play those games using your own hardware, and odds are by that time even a potato PC of its time will be able to play them as these are getting faster.
Even then I think companies underestimate how much people enjoy owning their own hardware, be it a console, or a PC good enough to play their favorite games without having to tie themselves to a yet another monthly subscription. Services are just that, their prices, terms, and contents change, making them volatile - your favorite game might be there one year for $15/month, next year it might go away, replaced by others for $30/month. At this point the lifecycles of consoles and PC hardware have increased tremendously - you can play almost every game there is on a console you bought in 2013 for $500. At the same time if your favorite game was released back then you could've paid $20-50 for it once and played it without having to pay a cent ever since. You will also be able to always go back to it as long as you Xbox is working, kind of like I can go back to my favorite Dreamcast games launched over 20 years ago for free, it's forever yours, with no risk of it ever going away. You paid for it, and nobody has any rights to influence your ability to play that game, ever. I find that there is a lot more value and just peace of mind in owning hardware and owning your game/license keys yourself, or even with a robust platform like Steam, which is the second best - if you paid $20 for a game there 15 years ago, today you can still play it even on your potato work laptop with 0 additional fees charged ever since.
Even then I think companies underestimate how much people enjoy owning their own hardware, be it a console, or a PC good enough to play their favorite games without having to tie themselves to a yet another monthly subscription. Services are just that, their prices, terms, and contents change, making them volatile - your favorite game might be there one year for $15/month, next year it might go away, replaced by others for $30/month. At this point the lifecycles of consoles and PC hardware have increased tremendously - you can play almost every game there is on a console you bought in 2013 for $500. At the same time if your favorite game was released back then you could've paid $20-50 for it once and played it without having to pay a cent ever since. You will also be able to always go back to it as long as you Xbox is working, kind of like I can go back to my favorite Dreamcast games launched over 20 years ago for free, it's forever yours, with no risk of it ever going away. You paid for it, and nobody has any rights to influence your ability to play that game, ever. I find that there is a lot more value and just peace of mind in owning hardware and owning your game/license keys yourself, or even with a robust platform like Steam, which is the second best - if you paid $20 for a game there 15 years ago, today you can still play it even on your potato work laptop with 0 additional fees charged ever since.
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I agree. GPU has been seen as a "steal" because the price is basically $1 more than what you paid for Live and the duration of Live that you paid for. CD Keys and other sites have Live for $30-40 a month, so three years (the max) is $120, tops, for three years of a buffet of games. Sure, some people just purchase Ultimate directly and pay more, but most people in the know, know about the $1 conversion deal, albeit being a one-time thing. But even after that, you let Live run out, buy it again for however long, and then pay for one month of GPU to convert it all over again. I know you know this, but to recap the savings and value people see in it.
I was all for it until a few weeks back when the surprise $120 announcement came out. $360 for three years, basically and that's basically a Series S with tax, or a Series S and another controller without tax. That's not value. Even hardcore games that spend $200-300 a year on games, the value is far less than $120 for 3 years, or $40 a year. The way Netflix lost Friends and The Office recently, I'd be upset if a game I was playing was taken off due to an expiring license for GPU. I know that's a problem with digital games you purchase; if the license expires for a game like Forza where the deal is with manufacturers or music rights, it gets de-listed and you're SOL. If you already own it, you might be able to re-download it but if you plan to go back and play an older Forza, tough luck.
That's what scared me about MS. I understand they still have to make money, especially with more acquisitions and publishers demanding a bigger cut of the pie for their games to get to GPU as demand for GPU increases. But $120 was too much and as a casual gamer, I can wait for a new game to release and purchase it for $10-20 less a few months later on. Or a sale. Say a game is $30-40, I'd buy one, maybe two a year and be good with it. Possibly re-sell it if I complete it and get some chump change in return. I don't think GPU would sound as good at that price. Unless someone wanted to play a MS Studios game, which will always be on GPU and never removed. After that, it's a carousel of games every 9 months and that's 9-12 months to finish games. As a kid, I could do it. But as a casual gamer, I wouldn't want to rush through a story-heavy game like The Witcher. Or Sleeping Dogs. Or a long game like RDR2. I'd be better off buying it and playing at my own pace.
I was big on COD and Halo 3 back in the 360 days. I'm still down for pick up and play multiplayer games, but I've heard even COD sucks now and has sucked for quite some time. And that game is on all platforms, not just Xbox or PC or PS5. I know Sony's acquisition of studios really helped them keep some killer apps on its consoles so that's why I'm leaning a bit more towards Sony now. I liked Halo for the MP, which is probably dead right now until Infinite comes out. but Fable is on PC, I think? I played Ori on PC and it's a fun game. But then I struggle to name Xbox exclusives that I couldn't find on PC. Console gaming is much easier and I'd still prefer a console to a PC set up, but the console that feels right and more "worth it" would be the PS4/5 for me. For those young kids on the Xbox subreddit that play 2-4 games a month to completion because school is out and they're locked down at home, GPU may make more sense. But it's quality over quantity and if $100 of games I purchase (digital or physical) are more enjoyable to me than the $40 GPU could possibly cost, then so be it.
I was all for it until a few weeks back when the surprise $120 announcement came out. $360 for three years, basically and that's basically a Series S with tax, or a Series S and another controller without tax. That's not value. Even hardcore games that spend $200-300 a year on games, the value is far less than $120 for 3 years, or $40 a year. The way Netflix lost Friends and The Office recently, I'd be upset if a game I was playing was taken off due to an expiring license for GPU. I know that's a problem with digital games you purchase; if the license expires for a game like Forza where the deal is with manufacturers or music rights, it gets de-listed and you're SOL. If you already own it, you might be able to re-download it but if you plan to go back and play an older Forza, tough luck.
That's what scared me about MS. I understand they still have to make money, especially with more acquisitions and publishers demanding a bigger cut of the pie for their games to get to GPU as demand for GPU increases. But $120 was too much and as a casual gamer, I can wait for a new game to release and purchase it for $10-20 less a few months later on. Or a sale. Say a game is $30-40, I'd buy one, maybe two a year and be good with it. Possibly re-sell it if I complete it and get some chump change in return. I don't think GPU would sound as good at that price. Unless someone wanted to play a MS Studios game, which will always be on GPU and never removed. After that, it's a carousel of games every 9 months and that's 9-12 months to finish games. As a kid, I could do it. But as a casual gamer, I wouldn't want to rush through a story-heavy game like The Witcher. Or Sleeping Dogs. Or a long game like RDR2. I'd be better off buying it and playing at my own pace.
I was big on COD and Halo 3 back in the 360 days. I'm still down for pick up and play multiplayer games, but I've heard even COD sucks now and has sucked for quite some time. And that game is on all platforms, not just Xbox or PC or PS5. I know Sony's acquisition of studios really helped them keep some killer apps on its consoles so that's why I'm leaning a bit more towards Sony now. I liked Halo for the MP, which is probably dead right now until Infinite comes out. but Fable is on PC, I think? I played Ori on PC and it's a fun game. But then I struggle to name Xbox exclusives that I couldn't find on PC. Console gaming is much easier and I'd still prefer a console to a PC set up, but the console that feels right and more "worth it" would be the PS4/5 for me. For those young kids on the Xbox subreddit that play 2-4 games a month to completion because school is out and they're locked down at home, GPU may make more sense. But it's quality over quantity and if $100 of games I purchase (digital or physical) are more enjoyable to me than the $40 GPU could possibly cost, then so be it.
In my envy of the PS exclusives, I got my hands on Horizon Zero Dawn. I'll give it a spin this weekend. Same with Yakuza 0, which is what was recommended as the one to start with.
I remember hearing the term "Yakuza" 20ish years ago and I remembered a game for the Xbox that had it in its title. After looking around for a while to see if it was the Yakuza series, I found the name of the game and it looks like it had nothing to do with the Yakuza series. It was Wreckless: The Yakuza Missions.
I remember hearing the term "Yakuza" 20ish years ago and I remembered a game for the Xbox that had it in its title. After looking around for a while to see if it was the Yakuza series, I found the name of the game and it looks like it had nothing to do with the Yakuza series. It was Wreckless: The Yakuza Missions.
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