Boycott Denmark & Norway
- Thread starter arabic187
- Start date
That cartoon however distatefull was not encouraging violence and gloryfying the death of innocent people , slight difference imo .
You missed my point , by having freedom of speech and the right to live peacefully in this country allows people to have thier say openly an freely , thier is no way in some of these middle eastern country baying for European blood would i be allowed on the streets and protest against that particular country screaming death and violence to all those that apposed me , no way on this earth . If these radical Muslims dont like it here then they should leave simple as that - shut the door on the way out . If this country is so bad why do thousands want to live here , i cant see many wanting to move to say Iran can you ?? And when kind people like aid workers go and try to help these countrys they are kidnapped and butchered . Nice society these people live in .
You missed my point , by having freedom of speech and the right to live peacefully in this country allows people to have thier say openly an freely , thier is no way in some of these middle eastern country baying for European blood would i be allowed on the streets and protest against that particular country screaming death and violence to all those that apposed me , no way on this earth . If these radical Muslims dont like it here then they should leave simple as that - shut the door on the way out . If this country is so bad why do thousands want to live here , i cant see many wanting to move to say Iran can you ?? And when kind people like aid workers go and try to help these countrys they are kidnapped and butchered . Nice society these people live in .
Does anyone read the posts in this thread?
All we seem to be doing is covering the same ground. No-one has said that those cartoons were good/right. Not one post I've seen in this thread is pro towards those cartoons. Also as far as I'm aware no-one here has said that they are a christian. I certainly don't consider myself a part of any religion. I have read many religious books and study materials, but I don't believe in god and find it hard to believe Jesus was just 1 man. So if you switched roles and they were mocking Jesus, I wouldn't give a shit.
The point everyone is trying to make is that people are allowed to speak their mind. People are given the freedom of speech. We may not like it, but it's healthy that freedom is there. I don't agree with a lot of things people say, but I'm glad they have the right to say it without persecution.
what i hate is if you read any middle east or pakistani paper they are heavily anti sematic but i guess thats ok because it done by not to those "picked on" muslims. Same thing when they bang on and on about palestine and conviently ignore the genocide of sudan. In truth i agree with jamie if they don't like it here they are free to leave-after all there are 60 muslim countries in the world. go live there be happy. But they won't mainly because these countries don't tolerate this type of nonsense case in point: Teck kneez (whats the bet that he lives in a western country)
Protests Set Fire to Danish Consulate, 18 Injured in Clashes with Security Forces
Beirut, Updated 05 Feb 06, 13:40
Demonstrators protesting caricatures depicting Prophet Mohammed set fire Sunday to a building housing the Danish mission in Beirut. Security forces fired tear gas at the crowds and their weapons in the air in a desperate attempt to stop the onslaught. At least 18 were injured with reports of fires and damage of public property.
Thousands of protesters took part in the rally held against publication of caricatures of Islam's revered prophet in European newspapers. The protest quickly degenerated into violence when groups of Islamic extremists tried to break through the security barrier, prompting troops to fire tear gas and water cannons from fire engines to try to disperse them, said the official.
Troops also fired repeatedly in the air and over the protesters' heads to keep the demonstrators away.
Security officials said at least 18 people were injured, including policemen, fire fighters and demonstrators. Witnesses saw at least 10 people taken away by ambulance.
The trouble threatened to take a sectarian spin especially after some protesters began stoning the nearby St. Maroun Church, one of the city's main Maronite Catholic churches in the district of Ashrafieh, a Christian area near Beirut's commercial district. Muslim clerics on the scene were seen trying to stop the protesters using shields and their hands.
Cars were overturned and their windows smashed and some people picked up rocks from the street and hurled them at nearby buildings.
The demonstrators also attacked policemen with stones and set fire to several fire engines, witnesses said. Black smoke was seen billowing from the area. They also burned Danish flags.
Justice Minister Charles Rizk called on those influential with the protesters to take action to bring the situation to an end.
"What is the guilt of the citizens of Ashrafieh of caricatures that were published in Denmark? This sabotage should stop," said Rizk, a Christian, in an interview on LBCI.
Some 2,000 army troops and riot police were deployed around the embassy building in the district of Ashrafieh, close to Beirut's commercial district. The protesters, who came in buses from all over Lebanon, waved green Islamic flags and banners, some of them reading: "O nation of Muhammad, wake up!" Muslim clerics were seen among the protesters.
Some witnesses said the protesters set fire to several cars and burned several Danish flags.
"There is no god but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of God!" they shouted as they tried to push their way against riot police to reach the embassy building.
Mohammed al-Sammak, a member of a committee advocating dialogue between Christians and Muslims, condemned the attacks on the church by some protesters. He said that the Vatican was among the first to denounce the cartoons depicting the prophet.
A security official said embassy staff had evacuated the building along with their belongings and documents two days ago, in anticipation of protests.
An Nahar reported on Sunday that the Danish diplomatic staff left Beirut Saturday night and headed to Copenhagen.
The violent demonstration comes a day after thousands of protesters in neighboring Syria, Damascus set fire to the Danish and Norwegian embassies in the most violent in days of furious protests by Muslims in Asia, Europe and the Middle East.(Naharnet-AP)(Outside photo shows the Danish consulate on fire and inside photo shows a protester burning the Danish flag)
http://www.naharnet.com/domino/tn/NewsDesk.nsf/getstory?openform&2D004D2FB818B1C6C225710C0033C101
Beirut, Updated 05 Feb 06, 13:40
Demonstrators protesting caricatures depicting Prophet Mohammed set fire Sunday to a building housing the Danish mission in Beirut. Security forces fired tear gas at the crowds and their weapons in the air in a desperate attempt to stop the onslaught. At least 18 were injured with reports of fires and damage of public property.
Thousands of protesters took part in the rally held against publication of caricatures of Islam's revered prophet in European newspapers. The protest quickly degenerated into violence when groups of Islamic extremists tried to break through the security barrier, prompting troops to fire tear gas and water cannons from fire engines to try to disperse them, said the official.
Troops also fired repeatedly in the air and over the protesters' heads to keep the demonstrators away.
Security officials said at least 18 people were injured, including policemen, fire fighters and demonstrators. Witnesses saw at least 10 people taken away by ambulance.
The trouble threatened to take a sectarian spin especially after some protesters began stoning the nearby St. Maroun Church, one of the city's main Maronite Catholic churches in the district of Ashrafieh, a Christian area near Beirut's commercial district. Muslim clerics on the scene were seen trying to stop the protesters using shields and their hands.
Cars were overturned and their windows smashed and some people picked up rocks from the street and hurled them at nearby buildings.
The demonstrators also attacked policemen with stones and set fire to several fire engines, witnesses said. Black smoke was seen billowing from the area. They also burned Danish flags.
Justice Minister Charles Rizk called on those influential with the protesters to take action to bring the situation to an end.
"What is the guilt of the citizens of Ashrafieh of caricatures that were published in Denmark? This sabotage should stop," said Rizk, a Christian, in an interview on LBCI.
Some 2,000 army troops and riot police were deployed around the embassy building in the district of Ashrafieh, close to Beirut's commercial district. The protesters, who came in buses from all over Lebanon, waved green Islamic flags and banners, some of them reading: "O nation of Muhammad, wake up!" Muslim clerics were seen among the protesters.
Some witnesses said the protesters set fire to several cars and burned several Danish flags.
"There is no god but Allah and Muhammad is the messenger of God!" they shouted as they tried to push their way against riot police to reach the embassy building.
Mohammed al-Sammak, a member of a committee advocating dialogue between Christians and Muslims, condemned the attacks on the church by some protesters. He said that the Vatican was among the first to denounce the cartoons depicting the prophet.
A security official said embassy staff had evacuated the building along with their belongings and documents two days ago, in anticipation of protests.
An Nahar reported on Sunday that the Danish diplomatic staff left Beirut Saturday night and headed to Copenhagen.
The violent demonstration comes a day after thousands of protesters in neighboring Syria, Damascus set fire to the Danish and Norwegian embassies in the most violent in days of furious protests by Muslims in Asia, Europe and the Middle East.(Naharnet-AP)(Outside photo shows the Danish consulate on fire and inside photo shows a protester burning the Danish flag)
http://www.naharnet.com/domino/tn/NewsDesk.nsf/getstory?openform&2D004D2FB818B1C6C225710C0033C101
'Free speech' is only borne out of the disbelief in an absolute value. All values in the western world are realtive. There is no such thing as 'free speech' just an absolute or relative value.
Technichally, (the reality is totally different), everybody unanimously in the western world agrees that paedohilia is wrong, there is absolutely no freedom in the UK or the US to say anything different. Imagine a cartoon suppoting paedophilia in the UK or Danish paper. It would not be 'freedom of sppech' then, would it? Because in this case the value is absolute with no compromise. (there's aren't many examples of absolute values i a secular society)
Homosexuality was classified as a mental illness in the 70's, nowadays marriage is allowed between same sex couples. What was absolute yesterday, is realative today and susequently what you would say freely today you were unable to say during the 70's. Don't refute this moving of the goal posts with a sweeping statement like ,'we are evolving towards a more civilised society', that would be arrogant and an ignorant and irreleavant to the issue.either way, 'Out with the old and in with the new' is not a faultless policy.
Your only free to say what you want as long as the value is held relatively, if it is absolute then the western world is just as quick to destroy a mans dignity or be disturbed by that view. Islamic values are much more absolute, the boundaries are more defined. How many articles in the western media have there been whcih have been derogatory to so many aspects of Islam the middle east, the woman there etc etc. You don't see an uproar about it. There is also much much debate in the Islamic world about everyday issues and many people disagree and differ on major issues.
It's to say that, man is fallible and as a muslim I would also agree with allowing others free speech and an opinion that may differ from mine.
But, in this incident the difference was that what was relative to the western world is absolute to the muslim world, that's the problem here and that is the clash between the two civilisations here, that muslims ask for others to respect.
Ansd stop confusing the issue with other bullshit, stay on-topic.
Technichally, (the reality is totally different), everybody unanimously in the western world agrees that paedohilia is wrong, there is absolutely no freedom in the UK or the US to say anything different. Imagine a cartoon suppoting paedophilia in the UK or Danish paper. It would not be 'freedom of sppech' then, would it? Because in this case the value is absolute with no compromise. (there's aren't many examples of absolute values i a secular society)
Homosexuality was classified as a mental illness in the 70's, nowadays marriage is allowed between same sex couples. What was absolute yesterday, is realative today and susequently what you would say freely today you were unable to say during the 70's. Don't refute this moving of the goal posts with a sweeping statement like ,'we are evolving towards a more civilised society', that would be arrogant and an ignorant and irreleavant to the issue.either way, 'Out with the old and in with the new' is not a faultless policy.
Your only free to say what you want as long as the value is held relatively, if it is absolute then the western world is just as quick to destroy a mans dignity or be disturbed by that view. Islamic values are much more absolute, the boundaries are more defined. How many articles in the western media have there been whcih have been derogatory to so many aspects of Islam the middle east, the woman there etc etc. You don't see an uproar about it. There is also much much debate in the Islamic world about everyday issues and many people disagree and differ on major issues.
It's to say that, man is fallible and as a muslim I would also agree with allowing others free speech and an opinion that may differ from mine.
But, in this incident the difference was that what was relative to the western world is absolute to the muslim world, that's the problem here and that is the clash between the two civilisations here, that muslims ask for others to respect.
Ansd stop confusing the issue with other bullshit, stay on-topic.
What's this issue got to do with the topic? LL Cool Singh! What a childish and pathetic argument. What's the fact that there are muslims living in the UK or US got to do with it. HAve you not the ability to accomodate 'other' and think about the world situation past this childish ignorance and the hatred you have for Pakistan.
First what other bullshit are you on about?
Also, if anyone is confusing the issue it is you. Using relative and absolute values, who speaks like that normally?
Paedophillia is illegal. Paedophillia images are illegal. A child is getting exploited. But discussion on paedophillia isn't illegal.
You are also a closet racist, as are many people in this thread. People on both sides of the argument. And you can see undertones of it in their writing. The mindset of US and THEM. Western Vs Eastern world.
I do not think like that. And again I say as you missed it, I DO NOT SUPPORT THE CARTOONS, I UNDERSTAND THE UPROAR, I SUPPORT PEACEFUL DEMONSTRATIONS, BUT FREEDOM OF SPEECH IS IMPORTANT.
And also - THE UK PAPERS DID NOT PUBLISH THE PICTURES!!!!
Also, if anyone is confusing the issue it is you. Using relative and absolute values, who speaks like that normally?
Paedophillia is illegal. Paedophillia images are illegal. A child is getting exploited. But discussion on paedophillia isn't illegal.
You are also a closet racist, as are many people in this thread. People on both sides of the argument. And you can see undertones of it in their writing. The mindset of US and THEM. Western Vs Eastern world.
I do not think like that. And again I say as you missed it, I DO NOT SUPPORT THE CARTOONS, I UNDERSTAND THE UPROAR, I SUPPORT PEACEFUL DEMONSTRATIONS, BUT FREEDOM OF SPEECH IS IMPORTANT.
And also - THE UK PAPERS DID NOT PUBLISH THE PICTURES!!!!
Read Tech neeks post and having seeing it deleted is all the response i need to give.
I have a question for Not realy ken - do you condone the actions of members of your religion who are protesting over the now imfanmous cartoons and who are baying for blood and calling for Jihad ? What is your personal opinion ? do you agree with this ?
Also do you not think the people in Middle eastern countrys and now London that are burning flags and rejoicing in 9/11 etc are portraying everything this cartoon rightly or wrongly suggests ?
I have been deeply offended by these protests in London but am not calling for the death of all Muslims - now should i now protest on the streets of London and encourage the death of innocent Muslims ?? If i did i bet my life i would be arrested unlike the muslims protesting in London .
I have a question for Not realy ken - do you condone the actions of members of your religion who are protesting over the now imfanmous cartoons and who are baying for blood and calling for Jihad ? What is your personal opinion ? do you agree with this ?
Also do you not think the people in Middle eastern countrys and now London that are burning flags and rejoicing in 9/11 etc are portraying everything this cartoon rightly or wrongly suggests ?
I have been deeply offended by these protests in London but am not calling for the death of all Muslims - now should i now protest on the streets of London and encourage the death of innocent Muslims ?? If i did i bet my life i would be arrested unlike the muslims protesting in London .
It is Taboo. So are the cartoons.
My opinion from your writings is that they were racist. As have a few others I've seen. There is no need. Again a reason why I hate religion, it divides people, but that's for another thread. But I understand why the Muslim community is pissed.
And it's You're ranting.
I'm done with this thread. I will only come in now to make sure there's no obvious racism, as I'd have banned about 4 people if I banned for what I've perceive as racism.
Do you think nothing is being done about those who protested? Notes and photos were taken, the police have a lot more information than they are given credit for.
And if white people were demonstrating like this, which the BNP regularily do, then the same action would be taken. This isn't a racial thing.
This is a small minority, there are 1000's of Muslims in London. Only about 50 were out for the protest calling for acts of Terrorism. It's like saying all white people are supportive of the BNP.
Edit - Now I'm done with this thread. :thumb:
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