Why do people say biggie and pac is the greatest?

[Think_ThuGLiFE]

haha , lil miiss VicksEN

Yes I've studied philosophers.

"All common sense", eh? Well a lot of it wasn't back then.

It wasnt..? Killing children wasnt wrong back then? Asking questions doesnt make you smart..?? wow the human race was pretty stupid back then...

Look, he died unfairly, & during his life had been wrongly perceived to be a criminal & was persecuted for it......sound familiar?

Yes it does , sounds a lil like 2pac .Soo the most respected Philospher has something already incommon with 2pac... and we r barly scratching the surface.

The same things that you would laud Tupac for you dismiss for Socrates - who truly changed the world, unlike Tupac.

Socrates did make you think , and try to make u use your brain.... what did 2pac do?.. r u kidding me , 2pac didnt have the same goals if not more then these respected philosphers..???

IM not trying 2 discredit anybody, they did do a lot for the way people thinked..but why r u discrediting 2pac.... doublestanders..

2pac is a philospher 4 the streets , the youth , the lost kids, and the ppl society threw away. Unlike Socrates ,kant, ect

2,000 years? No, they were respected well before then.

If it wasnt 4 Plato, Aristophanes and Xenophon no 1 would even have hurd of this guy , same with many other philosphers.

get ur facts str8 lil miss thing

And no amount of time with put Tupac in the same bracket, imo or world opinion.

Seems 2pacs already started his changing of the world. He wanted 2 spark the mind who will change the world.... 2 me it seems hes sparking a few minds just on this board ..

Its all opinion miss vicken , we live in a rasice fuck up world.... SOme ppl look at 2pac a Drug dealer with an empty soul or just a n i double g a who raps about guns ,sex, and drugs.....is that what he did? no.

Im thinkin of u as 1 of the ppl instead of moving forward , u take a step back ... doing nothing but talking... 2pac wanted ppl 2 do somethin

 

[CalcuoCuchicheo]

It wasnt..? Killing children wasnt wrong back then? Asking questions doesnt make you smart..?? wow the human race was pretty stupid back then...

Killing children isn't even wrong today fool. (hint: abortions)

Asking doesn't make you smart unless you're asking questions which require a great deal of insight to have been concocted.

And yes, almost every time "yesterday" is looked at, the human race does look stupid.

Yes it does , sounds a lil like 2pac .Soo the most respected Philospher has something already incommon with 2pac... and we r barly scratching the surface.

Ahh, the omission from what you quoted is duly noted.

Socrates did make you think , and try to make u use your brain.... what did 2pac do?.. r u kidding me , 2pac didnt have the same goals if not more then these respected philosphers..???

A midget spaztic can try to be the greatest basketball player of all time. Just because his goal paralleled that of Michael Jordan doesn't make them equals.

IM not trying 2 discredit anybody, they did do a lot for the way people thinked..but why r u discrediting 2pac.... doublestanders..

I'm not trying to "discredit" Tupac. The mere act of doing so would imply that Tupac had notable credit in the philosophical world to begin with - which he doesn't.

2pac is a philospher 4 the streets , the youth , the lost kids, and the ppl society threw away. Unlike Socrates ,kant, ect

Well then it's apt that the poor have their own poor philosopher.

If it wasnt 4 Plato, Aristophanes and Xenophon no 1 would even have hurd of this guy , same with many other philosphers.

get ur facts str8 lil miss thing

You said it took 2,000 years for us to have respect for "these people" - who I could only take to mean Socrates & his peers.

This would indicate that Socrates was not respected in say, 1900 - this is a falsehood, as I stated. Get your facts straight.

Seems 2pacs already started his changing of the world. He wanted 2 spark the mind who will change the world.... 2 me it seems hes sparking a few minds just on this board ..

And which minds would they be?

Certainly none in this section. Maybe you haven't noticed, but the rest of the board cringes at the lack of insight & intelligence in this section. I'm not going at anyone personally just saying, if you see minds sparking here then you have a quasi-unqiue talent.

Its all opinion miss vicken , we live in a rasice fuck up world.... SOme ppl look at 2pac a Drug dealer with an empty soul or just a n i double g a who raps about guns ,sex, and drugs.....is that what he did? no.

Well he was a drug dealer for a brief spell turned rapper who rapped about guns, sex & drugs so yes, that is what he did.

He did other things too, but the answer to your question is not "no" but "yes" because the man did do those things.

Im thinkin of u as 1 of the ppl instead of moving forward , u take a step back ... doing nothing but talking... 2pac wanted ppl 2 do somethin

This really takes the biscuit. You are going to look down upon me for doing nothing but talking.......on a messageboard!!

 

[Hituup]

Little Miss Vixen wrote:And it differs from individual to individual, but his poetry would not be accepted as high calibre in major poet circles.



You know what Little Miss Vixen, you talk as if you are some big time educated philosopher. Well you know what, you can try to pick up your dictionary and type up many vocabulary words you've probably never used in your life and try to sound like an English professor up here. But the truth is you are not more enlightened than anyone on here, so don't try to come here and dismiss Pac as an artists along with his fans.

I'm sure you are far from an intellectual and even if you were, who are you or any intellectual to dismiss anyones work of not being high calibre. This man is probably one of the most celebrated men of our time and you try to dismiss his work as if it is some small talk. I guess you'd only approve of the man's poetic work once its approved by scholars orhigh caliber people in major poetic circles eh. Well get an opinion of your own and stop trying to follow so called high calliber people in big positions that judges the works of others. At the end of the day if people recognize his work then that alone is an impact and makes him a philosopher.

 

[Think_ThuGLiFE]

I'm sure you are far from an intellectual and even if you were, who are you or any intellectual to dismiss anyones work of not being high calibre. This man is probably one of the most celebrated men of our time and you try to dismiss his work as if it is some small talk. I guess you'd only approve of the man's poetic work once its approved by scholars orhigh caliber people in major poetic circles eh. Well get an opinion of your own and stop trying to follow so called high calliber people in big positions that judges the works of others. At the end of the day if people recognize his work then that alone is an impact and makes him a philosopher.

Hit u up , i dont think we should attack her.. we all have our opinions but remember 1 thing

Educated ppl r very open minded.From what i see lil vickzen doesnt seem 2 open minded but its all good.

Going 2 bump White Manz world and Blasphemy and wonder how can u considered him as "nothing special" or"not in the same braket" as some1 had said....

 

[Hellrazor1978]

I am a hater. It's not Tupac I hate, it's his fans.

You really shouldnt be here then.

I cant stand Biggie's fans, but you dont see me posting at any Biggie forums, and you never will.

Get a fucking life man. You's a loser to the fullest.

You hate Pac's fans?? Well guess what, the feelings mutual buddy boy.

 

[Hellrazor1978]

Little Miss Vixen wrote:And it differs from individual to individual, but his poetry would not be accepted as high calibre in major poet circles.



You know what Little Miss Vixen, you talk as if you are some big time educated philosopher. Well you know what, you can try to pick up your dictionary and type up many vocabulary words you've probably never used in your life and try to sound like an English professor up here. But the truth is you are not more enlightened than anyone on here, so don't try to come here and dismiss Pac as an artists along with his fans.

I'm sure you are far from an intellectual and even if you were, who are you or any intellectual to dismiss anyones work of not being high calibre. This man is probably one of the most celebrated men of our time and you try to dismiss his work as if it is some small talk. I guess you'd only approve of the man's poetic work once its approved by scholars orhigh caliber people in major poetic circles eh. Well get an opinion of your own and stop trying to follow so called high calliber people in big positions that judges the works of others. At the end of the day if people recognize his work then that alone is an impact and makes him a philosopher.

100% on point. He aint shit.

 

[CalcuoCuchicheo]

You know what Little Miss Vixen, you talk as if you are some big time educated philosopher. Well you know what, you can try to pick up your dictionary and type up many vocabulary words you've probably never used in your life and try to sound like an English professor up here. But the truth is you are not more enlightened than anyone on here, so don't try to come here and dismiss Pac as an artists along with his fans.

You see, as with the poetry, it's all subjective. You may as well have said, "you know Little Miss Vixen, you write with the eloquence of a scholar".

And I can assure I need not use a dictionary to employ everyday words. If you are in some way impressed by my writing style then I pity you.

Am I not more enlightened? And you would know this because.....?

I never dismissed Tupac as an artist did I? I dismissed him as a highly credible philosopher & credible poetry (outwith rap).

I'm sure you are far from an intellectual and even if you were, who are you or any intellectual to dismiss anyones work of not being high calibre. This man is probably one of the most celebrated men of our time and you try to dismiss his work as if it is some small talk. I guess you'd only approve of the man's poetic work once its approved by scholars orhigh caliber people in major poetic circles eh. Well get an opinion of your own and stop trying to follow so called high calliber people in big positions that judges the works of others.

Hmm, it's a little odd how one minute my writing style makes you think I must be using some kind of literary aid - thus indicating you are somewhat impressed or have taken exception to it - & yet here you are "sure" that I'm "far from an intellectual", the foundation upon which you base this certainty apparently vacant.

I have the right to dismiss it, just as you have the right to admire it.

No, I accept works based on their merit & however I see fit. I'm not the one who tried to imply Tupac was some great philisopher & in order to rebut such claims I pointed out that he is not among those respected worldwide. I do respect the opinions of particular scholars who have particularly impressed me in the past but that does not absolve me of free thought. So in short, your "guess" is wrong.

At the end of the day if people recognize his work then that alone is an impact and makes him a philosopher.

No, that "impact" does not make him a philospher. The fact that the man thought & gave creative input into certain issues makes him a philosopher. And don't think I've went back on any of my statements, because I never claimed he wasn't a philosopher - a fact that makes me wonder why you added this little piece at the end.

Oh & don't think your unwillingness to directly rebut my arguments has escaped me for it has not.

 

[-=ArtofWar=-]

Damn, everybody here is saying B.I.G. is trash? Yall must not like rap, or you never heard this dude. B.I.G. has unbelievable flow, the sickest lyics ever from a rapper came from him. You could make a case for Big L and 2Pac, but I go with B.I.G. for lyrics, it just came to him in freestyles, sick.

Why? you putting down Big L lol who do you think is person that was about to put two artist that hated each other in the same song. (was but they both died) Why was Big L amazingly respected , so much that he put two of the most talented rappers in that era (if not ever) while they both were dissin each other is because L was more lyrical,had more flow in freestyle and speed to put behind that, yes Twista is faster than L but could he rap at his consistant pace and freestyle for 10 minutes without writtenin nothing down getting no breaks what so ever Big L is very underated could've battled both Biggie and Pac in a freestyle and win in one day ITS NOT DICK RIDDING IS A FACT even though im a bigger 2pac Fan, somewhat of a fan of Big L you gotta face the truth Big L could freestyle better than any rapper TODAY.

Well then it's apt that the poor have their own poor philosopher.

Do you think that every great philospher was always rich? Do you think everyone in this forum rich? your quote not only offended me but the works of 2pac. 2pac wasn't rappin for the rich and how good life was in the streets but the truth of the streets how the government left them behind not only did he showed the media the truth but he tried the youth to stop killin each other (for your so called great quotes "Say there ain't no hope for the youth and the truth is it ain't no hope for the future --Keep Ya Head Up ) 2pac never gained a penny from tellin people to kill each other (-_- like todays music) but told the people to make stand and learn probly a few people heard him saved a few lifes if it wasn't for him

yes there really is no such thing as good or bad poetry. Poetry is about human feelings you can never judge on what you never been through so your tellin me that you could judge a poet about deaths in wars when you yourself was never in one maybe to you it might be bogus but to a veteran it might be a masterpiece this is why poetry could never be good or bad (that shows us how much you know about the world)

One more thing history is never accurate and it gets even worse the more we go back beacuse people were seen more like gods than people unlike 2pac we seen him from start to end, now our country is trying to rewrite our history making there bad deeds seem good for example : the Alamo this is how much you trust your quotes from 2000 yrs ago we can't really prove the person really wrote this or it was said by him and rewritten by a smarter person (a person poor or has been through worse we will never know) yes years do add up and qoutes are written they loose there real meaning

 

[CalcuoCuchicheo]

Hit u up , i dont think we should attack her.. we all have our opinions but remember 1 thing

Educated ppl r very open minded.From what i see lil vickzen doesnt seem 2 open minded but its all good.

Going 2 bump White Manz world and Blasphemy and wonder how can u considered him as "nothing special" or"not in the same braket" as some1 had said....

You see, you started out this post very well. You advocated diplomacy.

And yes educated people are open minded. However I would like to know what, in your eyes, indicates narrow-mindedness on my behalf?

I have answered everything anyone has directed at me in this thread. I have broken down people's posts & gave my view clearly. You people on the other hand, have made a habit of ducking my arguments & plainly ignoring them.

I never said the man was "nothing special", so lose the quotation marks.

And I never mentioned anything about which bracket I'd place him in as a rap artist so again, as with so much of what has been posted here, I guess I'll have to stamp this null & void.

 

[CalcuoCuchicheo]

You really shouldnt be here then.

I cant stand Biggie's fans, but you dont see me posting at any Biggie forums, and you never will.

Get a fucking life man. You's a loser to the fullest.

You hate Pac's fans?? Well guess what, the feelings mutual buddy boy.

I shall cry myself to sleep knowing that the infamous Hellrazor1978 has scorned me so.

100% on point. He aint shit.

You dare say Tupac isn't shit?

 

[Hellrazor1978]

I shall cry myself to sleep knowing that the infamous Hellrazor1978 has scorned me so.

im sure you will.

anyone look at this dudes profile?? This cat is a MALE.....the fuck you doing with a name like Little Miss Vixen? Even a "no homo" in brackets next to that name cant save you now.

 

[Hellrazor1978]

You dare say Tupac isn't shit?

The most cliche and unimaginative reply in the book, trying to twist some ones words around.

Your username is Little Miss Vixen. I dont need to say anything else.

 

[tHuG $TyLe]

You really shouldnt be here then.

I cant stand Biggie's fans, but you dont see me posting at any Biggie forums, and you never will.

Get a fucking life man. You's a loser to the fullest.

You hate Pac's fans?? Well guess what, the feelings mutual buddy boy.

Not be here, why?
He hates the fans not Tupac, this is a Tupac forum, so he should be here.

 

[-=ArtofWar=-]

Little Miss Bitch - are you implicatin that we are narrow minded when your the arrogrant one here just becuase we didn't waste half our lifetime talking or writtening like a rich spoil brat doesn't mean we aren't educated maybe some of us don't spent our lifes in knowing new and complicated words that have 25 different meanings could be used a thousand ways

u should respond to my post if u said that you respond to everyones post

 

[Hituup]

You see, as with the poetry, it's all subjective. You may as well have said, "you know Little Miss Vixen, you write with the eloquence of a scholar".

And I can assure I need not use a dictionary to employ everyday words. If you are in some way impressed by my writing style then I pity you.

Am I not more enlightened? And you would know this because.....?

I never dismissed Tupac as an artist did I? I dismissed him as a highly credible philosopher & credible poetry (outwith rap).



Hmm, it's a little odd how one minute my writing style makes you think I must be using some kind of literary aid - thus indicating you are somewhat impressed or have taken exception to it - & yet here you are "sure" that I'm "far from an intellectual", the foundation upon which you base this certainty apparently vacant.

I have the right to dismiss it, just as you have the right to admire it.

No, I accept works based on their merit & however I see fit. I'm not the one who tried to imply Tupac was some great philisopher & in order to rebut such claims I pointed out that he is not among those respected worldwide. I do respect the opinions of particular scholars who have particularly impressed me in the past but that does not absolve me of free thought. So in short, your "guess" is wrong.



No, that "impact" does not make him a philospher. The fact that the man thought & gave creative input into certain issues makes him a philosopher. And don't think I've went back on any of my statements, because I never claimed he wasn't a philospher - a fact that makes me wonder why you added this little piece at the end.

Oh & don't think your unwillingness to directly rebut my arguments has evaded for it has not.

No one here is impressed by your writing style. But its funny how you come on a forum and try to sound like a man/woman of wisdom. If you dismiss Pac as a poet and philosopher then you are dismissing part of him as an aritsts. First of all your strategy of analyzing evey piece of reply is your way of trying to look or seem coherent, but you can not fool anyone with that as anyone could try to write or reply like a wizard.

Whatever, I'm not here to go back and forth all day. You are entitled to your opinion, but if you want to win the argument go ahead and win. I'll pronounce you as a winner if it suits you. But don't sit here and perpetually try to down a hero and its fans/followers because he's doesn't fit the stereotype or have the background of the average philosophers that you have studied and so forth. And yes you can analyze the sentence before this in awe because that is the main reason why you denounce 2pac the poet & philosopher.

 

[CalcuoCuchicheo]

Do you think that every great philospher was always rich? Do you think everyone in this forum rich? your quote not only offended me but the works of 2pac. 2pac wasn't rappin for the rich and how good life was in the streets but the truth of the streets how the government left them behind not only did he showed the media the truth but he tried the youth to stop killin each other (for your so called great quotes "Say there ain't no hope for the youth and the truth is it ain't no hope for the future --Keep Ya Head Up ) 2pac never gained a penny from tellin people to kill each other (-_- like todays music) but told the people to make stand and learn probly a few people heard him saved a few lifes if it wasn't for him

You know, I can understand how you misread what I said but really, read things carefully next time.

The word "poor" is a homonym.

I was told Tupac philosophized for those in the streets, for the poor. So there you have my first use of the word poor, as in, no money.

I commented on how apt it was for the poor (those with no money) to have a poor philosopher. In this instance, my use of the word poor is in regards to quality. In other words, I am saying Tupac was not a very good philosopher.

If you understand that, then I'm pretty sure you'll agree that your points there, while all well & good, are irrelevant to what I orginally posted.

yes there really is no such thing as good or bad poetry. Poetry is about human feelings you can never judge on what you never been through so your tellin me that you could judge a poet about deaths in wars when you yourself was never in one maybe to you it might be bogus but to a veteran it might be a masterpiece this is why poetry could never be good or bad (that shows us how much you know about the world)

We've already established that poetry is subjective.

And poetry need not be solely about emotions.

I can't judge what I've not been through, is that so?

I've never been hit by a double decker bus but I can almost guarantee you it will hurt.

And if we cannot judge that which we have not been through, then how do you judge your music of choice? I'm almost certain you have not been through everything you've ever heard in song, but yet you will judge it, will you not?

 

[CalcuoCuchicheo]

im sure you will.

anyone look at this dudes profile?? This cat is a MALE.....the fuck you doing with a name like Little Miss Vixen? Even a "no homo" in brackets next to that name cant save you now.

Save me from what? lol

The most cliche and unimaginative reply in the book, trying to twist some ones words around.

Your username is Little Miss Vixen. I dont need to say anything else.

I was merely trying to figure who "ain't shit".

Yes, sit down, you've said nothing enough times.

 

[CalcuoCuchicheo]

Little Miss Bitch - are you implicatin that we are narrow minded when your the arrogrant one here just becuase we didn't waste half our lifetime talking or writtening like a rich spoil brat doesn't mean we aren't educated maybe some of us don't spent our lifes in knowing new and complicated words that have 25 different meanings could be used a thousand ways

u should respond to my post if u said that you respond to everyones post

No, I'm not implying anything of the sort.

And I have responded to your post. I respond chronologically, happy?

 

[-=ArtofWar=-]

well Little Miss Bitch Im tired of arguing you won sometimes the big winner knows when to let the hard headed win

this must have been said around one of your big quotes back from the A.D era

 

[CalcuoCuchicheo]

No one here is impressed by your writing style. But its funny how you come on a forum and try to sound like a man/woman of wisdom. If you dismiss Pac as a poet and philosopher then you are dismissing part of him as an aritsts. First of all your strategy of analyzing evey piece of reply is your way of trying to look or seem coherent, but you can not fool anyone with that as anyone could try to write or reply like a wizard.

I was confident you would not say you were "impressed" so I added in the idea of you taking exception to my writing style also. And you can put it to me like that all you want, but it was you not I who highlighted my writing style which, up until that point, had appeared perfectly normal to me.

My dismissing of Tupac as a philosopher & poet, has no effect on my opinion of him as a rap artist. Only I can accurately say what's on my mind, so it might be best if you stop making assumptions.

And no, my "strategy" is employed simple to make sure I answer everyone fully. My conviction is strong enough to do so, I see that yours may not be.

A wizard? I really can't comment on this because I've never perused the works of a wizard.

Whatever, I'm not here to go back and forth all day. You are entitled to your opinion, but if you want to win the argument go ahead and win.

Yes I am, just as you are entitled to your opinion.

This situation is not about "winning".

I'll pronounce you as a winner if it suits you. But don't sit here and perpetually try to down a hero and its fans/followers because he's doesn't fit the stereotype or have the background of the average philosophers that you have studied and so forth. And yes you can analyze the sentence before this in awe because that is the main reason why you denounce 2pac the poet & philosopher.

A sentence ago I was entitled to my opinion now I'm being told not to speak my mind. That's nice.