Makaveli and Biggie

[Minardi]

Truth be told I don’t think Ive really listened to Makaveli in about a year. Not because I don’t like it, quite the opposite, I like it so much it makes me more mad and sad to have lost Tupac. I didn’t really post an RIP message on the board, but damn, Jon and I were talking yesterday about how much ‘Pac really has influenced our lives in light of his son being born soon. Anyway, Makaveli is just that piece of music that moves me. I still get shivers up my spine with some tracks.

Anyway last night I was driving home from my girls house and found myself analyzing Pac’s words more rather than just feeling them. Apart from strengthening my opinion that he was underrated as a lyricist (lots of double play on the CD for example), I notice that Pac doesn’t really attack Biggie at all on the CD. He barely mentions him, one of the Outlawz mentions the King Of New York on Bomb First, but Pac doesn’t really throw any shots at Big. And that’s kind of surprising because he attacks EVERYONE else. I mean, Hit Em Up really is nothing compared to Against All Odds. You have to remember this is 96, a different time, no one really mentioned big time New York gangsters on tracks back then, let alone dissed them.

Then you have all the shots thrown at Nas, Mobb Deep, Puff Daddy and Bad Boy, Jay Z and others, but Makaveli doesn’t really mention Biggie. Kind of makes you think… Was ‘Pac just not giving a fuck about BIG or was he forgiving him?

I feel ya 100%.

2pac on the Makaveli album seems more clear about what happened in the 94' shooting, he mentions the names of those behind, he didnt really do that before.

maybe he got more information about the shooting at the time of recording, wich lowered Biggies role in the shooting.
Surprices me that in all the interviews and articles about that album noone actually questioned why Biggie aint mentioned.

 

[Kaya]

I think he just left big alone to breathe or something..coz he destroyed his name pretty much in hitemup. I mean come on when I think about big I just cant help it but to think about what pac said about him >>> u clame to be a playa but I fucked yo wife , u phat phony etc etc etc etc So he destroyed him and now there where some other rappers getting in the way so he had to focus his attention on them…

But at the end when u listen to his last interview…he wanted to have peace eventually and move on to some higher shit …but only when his enemies would scroll to him and recognize him for what he stood for….


And yeah I agree with you…pac is way underrated….his lyrics are indeed sometimes double….his poetic rhythm is straight fire…only his peoticcs at the age of 17 says it all….nobody can touch his state of mind…its just way to spiritual…that’s why he will out live time and space…coz we are all spiritual human beings but pac was open for it and he rhymed with that spiritual state of mind…

Not that pac is the only one in this world who recognize his soul but he was the famous rapper that understood it.(jus like bob Marley was in reggae) I quess that’s why u (and me too) just sometimes hate it he died to early coz he touches u like a big brother…u gives u advise/secret massages in his lyrics..Like he is in the same room or something….he talks to you from soul to soul….heart to heart…no lies just pure live stories….but everybody has his/her own path to follow and his own time to die…so it aint bad at all..it was just his time to go in the physical world but he remains here in the spiritual world.

 

[Hankaveli]

I would like to Mention. that Pac said some shit about how he ain't no Bully, he was not gonna keep picking on Biggie, If Biggie would have came back at him he would have made another song. But Biggie kept his mouth shut, plus what more could pac say really?

 

[Pittsey]

What Biggie done was initially out of fear. 2pac understood that. He thought Biggie was less of a man. But realised Biggie didn't turn his back on him for money or fame.

Like you said Rukas, Pac probably realised Biggie was a pawn and decided to go after the Bigger fish as he'd already made his feelings clear on Biggie on several other songs especially hit em up. On "Against All Odds" he addressed the rappers who he felt he hadn't covered.

 

[B.Lorenzo]

Rukas I really agree with you when you say Pac was an underrated lyricist, Pac has said some shyt that I was like damn Pac you could really spit. But yeah me and my boyz talk about Pac a lot and if he were here today and where would he be and what would he be doing. It's really amazing the knowledge and wisdom he had at such a young age especially looking at old interviews when he was 20/21 and just be in amazement. Sept. 12th I was in the post office and it was a guy 2 spots ahead of me. As I'm looking looking at the guy I noticed he was decked down in all red, I looked at his arm and he had the tribal tatto like Pac had, then he turns around and has Outlaw between the tribal marks. Well to shorten the story he had Notorious down the right side of his arm, the MOB tat. F**K the World also, so I'm thinking either this guy knew Pac or he is one hell of a fan b/c he looked to be in his early to mid-30's. So I got his attention and asked did he know Pac or was he just a big fan, he was like I'm a big fan of Pacs a big fan and we just talked for a few after that. With that said I wonder like I alwayz do if Pac's influence is this strong 9 years after his DEATH where would he be now if he still were alive b/c little kids around the way I see or know around the ages of 10-14 tell me Pac isn't their favorite rapper but he is the best rapper ever. Only if Pac were still here....

 

[KO]

Good question Rukas, i think Pac felt he had dealt with the Biggie situation and made his feelings be known worldwide, and it was time to move on

 

[LL COOL PAC]

a few things wan't friends suppose to be on the dk7 album- even though it was cut of its was still made at that time so you can tell pac was still thinking about big. as far as not mentioning big if you listen to the interview you can hear hoe frustrated pac is over people continually mentioning big. maybe big was just the first stepping stone to where he wanted to go. one thing i notice about pac though whilst he was in jail i think he recognised or felt that he had been limiting himself alot by continually playing the bad guy so when he got released he was alot more accessible which then imo made him want more in terms of rather than being a rapper and actor he saw a thousand other fields that he could go into. rather than simply being down for the young black male all the time he had the potential to be at the cutting edge of music. so for this i think he was listening to a lot of groundbreaking albums from megastars ie prince michael j the beatles etc- and then trying to improve them ie thug nature. personally i think he would have gone the way of prince with producing the music as well as vocals for a more personal type of music. either way he like hendrix was incredibly frustrated at the end of his life and his answer i suppose was to work harder and hope for something good to come out of it.
sorry if this is irrelevant

 

[DeeezNuuuts83]

^^ Yes, Friends was supposed to be on the Makaveli album, but it was cut, and itwas a decision made while Pac was alive. In his VIBE interview, he was already talking about the Makaveli album being "twelve tracks," which is how it was released. So don't think that Death Row or whoever snipped it out after he died.

 

[StatiC]

in tha intro they mention him..alobng wit´mobb sleep and gay-z "notorious p.i.g...."

:thumb:

 

[Devious]

Well, the way I see it, Pac had already said what he had to say about Biggie on Hit Em Up. It was after that that people like Jay-Z and Mobb Deep started to say shit about it, and Pac felt he needed to address that, as well as fully address the 94 shooting and what he felt went down with his rape charge and Haitian Jack's involvement. Like some other people said, Biggie never dissed Pac back, not really, but I'm sure if Big would've put olut a diss to him he would have responded. Saying all this, however, I don't think anyone but Pac can tell us what he was thinking at this time. It's a good question though. I believe that if both had lived, Pac would have eventually settled his beef with Big

 

[DutchMakaveli]

The 'big' disses were taken off of the album after 'Pac died, hence hardly a BIG mention.

 

[Nick]

The 'big' disses were taken off of the album after 'Pac died, hence hardly a BIG mention.

I remember Dante saying that the Bomb First OG had some harsh words for Biggie, so maybe there were more BIG references that were removed.

 

[Rock]

Basically, 2Pac ran Biggie to the ground with one record, "Hit Em Up". Thats all that was needed because Biggie couldn't say shit after that. So what happened is he ended up moving on to dissing other people associated with Bad Boy and etc.. There was no reason to diss BIG anymore.

 

[JarG]

but Pac was the man who removed all the disses from final product

 

[Freedom Froggy]

as a lyricist... ima be honest.. pac was very repetitive with his words and such

but makaveli was of a different breed.... incredible album

 

[LAZARU$]

cus pac put the hit on biggie

 

[Ricardo_Brown]

i dont think 2pac was the kind of person who kicks someone whos down.. 2pac knew that biggie was done after hit em up came out.. look at the footage from the house of blues "when they say something to us, we wanna make sure we mash there ass like we did biggie" like many others have said in this thread, 2pac was proberly moving on to other enemies

 

[Rukas]

as a lyricist... ima be honest.. pac was very repetitive with his words and such

but makaveli was of a different breed.... incredible album

It only seems that way because he has SOOO much music. But most of the repetitivness, at least in my opinion, came after he died with the unreleased tracks.

 

[Freedom Froggy]

It only seems that way because he has SOOO much music. But most of the repetitivness, at least in my opinion, came after he died with the unreleased tracks.

well thats pretty much the music i mean.. let me clarify that...the unreleased clips

 

[Swollen_Member]

Pac seemed to diss Biggie more in interviews more than on track.