2pac never intended to continue making music?

masta247

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A post here got me thinking and sent me on a 2-day spree of going through 2pac's personal notes and letters. This one struck me - a note/letter that he wrote while in jail suggesting he had to convince himself to drop one more album (Supreme Euthanasia, but with DR's backing it ended up being AEOM instead):

1613385074935.png

By the way this was sent to the lady that Deathrow Records hired to reach out to 2pac while he was in jail. She concluded that he initially communicated despair and decision to leave public life, and over the course of their communication "regained courage to return".
 
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I also can't get over the fact that 2pac died with just $105k to his name - no own home, and just one chequing account holding all of his assets - everything else was leased or lent by Death Row. And that his living conditions were never what you'd call first world up until a short time before jail and mere months of borrowed luxury with Death Row. And that his movie contracts paid him just ~$75k a pop for the main roles. And that he thought he was deep in red until his death with still over $4M to repay to Death Row even after AEOM's success.

He never saw the millions that his estate ended up winning/earning after he died. There are no-names that made much more money on his name after his death than he ever had.
 
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I also can't get over the fact that 2pac died with just $105k to his name - no own home, and just one chequing account holding all of his assets - everything else was leased or lent by Death Row. And that his living conditions were never what you'd call first world up until a short time before jail and mere months of borrowed luxury with Death Row. And that his movie contracts paid him just ~$75k a pop for the main roles. And that he thought he was deep in red until his death with still over $4M to repay to Death Row even after AEOM's.

He never saw the millions that his estate ended up winning/earning after he died. There are no-names that made much more money on his name after his death than he ever had.

Wow that is crazy I never knew that
 
I also can't get over the fact that 2pac died with just $105k to his name - no own home, and just one chequing account holding all of his assets - everything else was leased or lent by Death Row. And that his living conditions were never what you'd call first world up until a short time before jail and mere months of borrowed luxury with Death Row. And that his movie contracts paid him just ~$75k a pop for the main roles. And that he thought he was deep in red until his death with still over $4M to repay to Death Row even after AEOM's.

He never saw the millions that his estate ended up winning/earning after he died. There are no-names that made much more money on his name after his death than he ever had.

He didn't live long enough for them royalty checks and the movies he starred in released post posthumously. I think Danny Boy, Kidada or someone else associated with Pac at the time said Pac was getting paid $50,000 a month and half of it was going to his family and apparently his fam was harassing him for more money. Also fucked up, Pac was paying for Nate Doggs child support.
 
He didn't live long enough for them royalty checks and the movies he starred in released post posthumously. I think Danny Boy, Kidada or someone else associated with Pac at the time said Pac was getting paid $50,000 a month and half of it was going to his family and apparently his fam was harassing him for more money. Also fucked up, Pac was paying for Nate Doggs child support.

Yeah he spent a lot of the money he made up until 1993 on the property in Georgia that he ended up just gifting to Kato's family like it's nothing - he said it was meant to be for his own family but they "didn't appreciate it". Then in 95 he bought another one for Afeni again that she ended up living in. He borrowed $300k that he didn't have to house a lot of his friends in a fancy LA hotel once he moved there.
All the while, after having released three albums and starring in a couple of movies he lived in a $1500/month rental apartment in this building:
1613503930058.png

His first nice home was rented out for him by Death row once he got released from jail in 1995. He literally made a down payment to eventually buy it, but died before he could make that happen. And this would've been the first home he actually owned in his life. I was shocked that 2pac gave away almost everything he had. It's not a well known fact, it wasn't even to me.

The early movies and music he made were bulk sum payments, and the payments were surprisingly small with all of them being five figures afaik. Then his DR deal was basically "make 3 albums to pay us back the bail we paid for you". He formally got his 12% royalty deal then too, but that was just on paper - he had to borrow even more money as DR charged him for almost everything (living expenses that they paid for him, but also album promotion and music video costs that they said he's got to pay for). In reality DR basically arbitrarily decided what they're paying him and what they're further charging him for up until he finishes his third and final album for them. I guess no wonder he recorded the second one in 3 days (that DR wanted to spin as a mixtape, not a full LP) and was almost done with the third. Afeni won her case against Death Row with judge agreeing that they basically fucked him over. She ended up winning a couple million + a better royalty deal with DR, but 2pac was already gone at that time.
 
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Yeah he spent a lot of the money he made up until 1993 on the property in Georgia that he ended up just gifting to Kato's family like it's nothing - he said it was meant to be for his own family but they "didn't appreciate it". Then in 95 he bought another one for Afeni again that she ended up living in. He borrowed $300k that he didn't have to house a lot of his friends in a fancy LA hotel once he moved there.
All the while, after having released three albums and starring in a couple of movies he lived in a $1500/month rental apartment in this building:
View attachment 526

.

do you have the address of this place?
 
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OK 2 random Pac questions been bugging me:

Who owns his music now (is there more unreleased)
What happened to his centre of arts in Georgia?

The centre doesn't exist anymore. The story partially answering those questions is briefly covered here:
What Happened to the Tupac Amaru Shakur Center for the Arts? – Rolling Stone

Personally, I think it doesn't begin to scratch the surface as his legacy has been grossly mismanaged. Not out of malice, they failed at making money out of fucking 2pac! I think it's just that nobody had a clue what they were doing or what they should be doing and were just throwing punches in the dark. They also closed their doors in front of people who actually knew how to help and really wanted to! I heard stories before about no-names with original 2pac recordings that they wanted to sell back to the estate and rumors were the estate wouldn't budge and would try to sue them for the recordings instead, which sent a message to small time rappers or producers who had 2pac tapes that it's not worth doing anything about them - this likely led to some original tapes being sold as bootlegs or worse, just rotting away forgotten in someone's old collection. After all bumping the only copy of a cool 2pac track you recorded with him back in 94 can at least get you laid, which is a better alternative than losing that and getting sued the shit out of.

There's a lot of unreleased Tupac music still. Heck the songs I'm aware of could make at least three or four perfectly good albums. Plus there are so many discarded verses when they actually released his remixed posthumous music too - I have no idea how they're planning to release these, I kind of assume it would be really difficult at this point to tell people that the parts they used for Ghetto Gospel made up for less than a fourth of what 2pac actually recorded, and that there are three more amazing verses altogether, with a completely different vibe and pacing, and that they were making for a whole nice story meant for children with mental and physical disabilities. It was a song he recorded for the actual special olympics, it was rejected because his music wasn't exactly well perceived at the time. He was passionate about it and there's an interview where he's going on and on about it. It's just I somehow doubt the people who managed his legacy even had any understanding of such powerful meanings and stories behind his songs. They were just broken down into scraps and put together into something without much of its original meaning or soul.

As for the unreleased music, legally I believe the Estate has the RIGHT to all or most of it. Except the suspects they could enforce it from aren't happily screaming "sue me, I've got unreleased tapes", and means of obtaining them again are dwindling as time passes. Most of the posthumously released songs were big-time tracks that were serious contenders for big album releases when Tupac was still alive. Such masters were definitely by far the easiest to obtain - the labels had them. Little of his collabs and leaks that we know of that he just casually recorded for others actually made it, meaning they may not even have these masters.
I somehow suspect that the estate may not even have many remaining masters at all, and worst of all I wouldn't be all that surprised if they were unaware of the existence of many of the songs we play mp3s of on a daily basis, lol. Snoop Dogg played "Street Life" live on the fucking radio, it's a potential banger, and my level of confidence in the estate is so low that I wouldn't be surprised if nobody even reached out to him about it. I'm sure Daz has some rare 2pac shit making for his weed-smoking soundtrack that he wants just to himself.

I bet the estate also hears a song like "Till my Dyin Day" on Youtube wondering "wtf did that come from, who's got CDQ of that?!". I remember the CDQ being sold for a couple of grand long ago, but I somehow doubt the estate ever discovered that, let alone obtain it, and I wouldn't be surprised if the best they got was that shitty tape rip. It will be much harder to get that CDQ in the future, heck I have no idea how to get it at this point. Then even if they got a song like that, it's not impossible that they just wouldn't release it as it's difficult to make that particular song represent the image of 2pac they want to present. They already censored or removed much softer lyrics, in particular in his post-2000 albums. They made 2pac into something he's not in the latest albums, and what sells is the true 2pac which they haven't been too keen on showing lately, pumping out a watered down and heavily mutated new vision they had instead.

I'm also not sure if there are still people out there who know, care and are paid and empowered to do anything about the situation. In my mind it's a couple of people with a specific but limited vision who aren't really in the know at this point, represented by some disconnected lawyer. Which is a terrifying thought actually. Fuck, Rukas recently posted that Tupac's Spotify library isn't even managed by his Estate but by DJ King Assassin profiting off of it instead. Assuming it most likely hasn't gotten anyone's green light, how little attention they must be paying to let it fly?
The information about Tupac's music and stories is also heavily scattered across the few remaining forums, and some is dying completely offline with people in Oakland or Marin City. I bet there is information we have amongst the few of us here on Streethop (regulars or former regulars) that nobody or very few people are aware of, that we will die with, lol.

Then there's the fact that some of his darkest and most aggressive Death Row stuff is probably being sat on by.. Hasbro, who indirectly bought the Death Row vaults.. lol.
 
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Thank you so much for taking the time to tell me all of that info, I really appeciate it. I wanted to ask on here as I knew i would get accurate information.

I just think that it is so sad that there is all of those tracks, verses etc out there that we will never get to listen to in its raw version or even at all. This makes me so sad.

He would of wanted his music to live on and I belive that his mum does too but like you said above I am not sure that they knew enough to know to go about it.

Shit if i was loaded i would track them all down and get them out there.

Even after all of this time, I want his legacy to live on through his music and his words.

Makes me sad that it will probably never happen

I still listen to him on a regular basis and i don't think that will ever change, his music has helped me through some hard times and he has been a way of escape to me.

@Casey what are your thoughts on this?
 
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I just think that it is so sad that there is all of those tracks, verses etc out there that we will never get to listen to in its raw version or even at all. This makes me so sad.

Yeah it's super sad and no problem. When I think about it once in a while and seeing another year pass without a new Tupac album I get angry.

If I were there, I'd just put together an album called, say "Reincarnation", slap this as a cover so message is sent and people feel kicked in the nuts that 2pac is reborn, or design something representing Tupac and reincarnation, pull together unreleased songs that go together like the ones below and just release them as is:

1. Reincarnation
2. Street Life (If no way to clear samples, use remixes with actual Tupac vibes, like this)
3. Don't Stop The Music
4. Changed Man (remix was released, but OG would go just sooo well)
5. Ride for Me
6. Brothaz at Armz (they already released most of the One Nation songs so might as well)
7. Too Late Playa
8. Tongue Kissing
9. Just Watchin
10. My Own Style
11. Komradz
12. Watch Ya Mouth
13. Road To Glory
14. Where Ya Been
15. Outro: Time To Get My Drink On

Boom, DON'T TOUCH SHIT with the beats and that's a perfectly classic 2pac album worth of unreleased songs with amazing 90s vibes that people will love, and plenty of single-candidates that the estate could release within months, and I thought of it in 5 mins by pulling unreleased songs that are easily available! I'd listen to it on repeat.

Then follow up with more like this, for instance in a year or two release one with awesome MATW/Euthanasia discards and remaining Thug Life tracks, bangers with Live Squad like "It Hurts the Most" or "Big Tyme".
We have perfectly clean CDQs in common circulation of all of those even if there aren't masters available. OGs of those songs are amazing enough to make excellent albums on their own.
 
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I also can't get over the fact that 2pac died with just $105k to his name - no own home, and just one chequing account holding all of his assets - everything else was leased or lent by Death Row. And that his living conditions were never what you'd call first world up until a short time before jail and mere months of borrowed luxury with Death Row. And that his movie contracts paid him just ~$75k a pop for the main roles. And that he thought he was deep in red until his death with still over $4M to repay to Death Row even after AEOM's success.

He never saw the millions that his estate ended up winning/earning after he died. There are no-names that made much more money on his name after his death than he ever had.

The thing is that’s just accounting. In hindsight it was his own fault really.

He signed to Death Row and Suge put up the bail money - he needed to pay that back.

AEOM was an expensive album - he needed to pay that back. The videos, features, etc.

He entered the situation heavily in the red. Plus all the legal fees.

He’d probably have started seeing some money back off of Makaveli. But let’s remember, he was actually only a Death Row recording artist for about 9 months.

Afeni didn’t necessarily sue for the money he made while on Death Row, but for the rights to everything that came after, which he’d have probably seen.

I know the community really jumped on this bandwagon when we were younger but it’s just business.

Pac owed money. Everything he was making was paying that back. So he probably couldn’t afford cars and houses and needed them leased at the time. I’d even go so far as to say he credit was probably shot too so he couldn’t get a lot in his name. Remember it was less than a year for him. He was broke before jail. He was in debt after jail. 1996 was a recoup year from him and he’d have started enjoying the money had he lived.

That’s why he was working so hard, to put enough product out there to get back in the green AND then start profiting.
 
Yeah it's super sad and no problem. When I think about it once in a while and seeing another year pass without a new Tupac album I get angry.

If I were there, I'd just put together an album called, say "Reincarnation", slap this as a cover so message is sent and people feel kicked in the nuts that 2pac is reborn, or design something representing Tupac and reincarnation, pull together unreleased songs that go together like the ones below and just release them as is:

1. Reincarnation
2. Street Life (If no way to clear samples, use remixes with actual Tupac vibes, like this)
3. Don't Stop The Music
4. Changed Man (remix was released, but OG would go just sooo well)
5. Ride for Me
6. Brothaz at Armz (they already released most of the One Nation songs so might as well)
7. Too Late Playa
8. Tongue Kissing
9. Just Watchin
10. My Own Style
11. Komradz
12. Watch Ya Mouth
13. Road To Glory
14. Where Ya Been
15. Outro: Time To Get My Drink On

Boom, DON'T TOUCH SHIT with the beats and that's a perfectly classic 2pac album worth of unreleased songs with amazing 90s vibes that people will love, and plenty of single-candidates that the estate could release within months, and I thought of it in 5 mins by pulling unreleased songs that are easily available! I'd listen to it on repeat.

Then follow up with more like this, for instance in a year or two release one with awesome MATW/Euthanasia discards and remaining Thug Life tracks, bangers with Live Squad like "It Hurts the Most" or "Big Tyme".
We have perfectly clean CDQs in common circulation of all of those even if there aren't masters available. OGs of those songs are amazing enough to make excellent albums on their own.

A Masterpiece right there
 
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Here's the thing. Posthumous Estates are harrrrrddddd to manage. I am close with the people running the Prince Estate - I was hanging out with them in Minneapolis in 2019. You wouldn't believe the amount of shit they have to deal with, and that's even with having a more fastidious overview of assets, since Prince had all his masters stored at Paisley Park, it's not like the Pac situation where who even knows where tapes, reels and other assets are.

And although they continue to generate vast amounts of revenue, the Michael Jackson Estate is a complete joke of mismanagement, shitty remixes, and consistently bizarre decisions.


And ironically enough, for all of them, actually releasing music is often not the top priority (credit due to the Prince Estate who have excelled at actually putting out a BUNCH of stuff in the last few years and doing it properly and respectfully). That's due to the state of the music industry. Mostly, they'll make more money licensing a song to be used in a movie than they would make from an entire posthumous album project. It's not uncommon to make a million dollars or more from ONE song being used in big movie or an advert.


The other thing is that with Tupac there's always multiple parties involved. The producers of the songs, for a start. Generally they want to get them remixed, so you need to make sure you're square with say, Capucine Jackson (Johnny's widow, who is a lovely person), as well as organising the right producer to remix it, as well as any features that might be on it. Then you've got problematic people continuing to throw lawsuits into the mix over any given song - for example, even after losing the catalog, Death Row continued to try and serve injunctions about various songs for years. They might not have legal rights to anything, but you can bet that Yaasmyn Fula will have her voice heard for anything that Kadafi was on - Fatal's family? Maybe Napoleon doesn't want certain things released because he's a Muslim now, no more dope game. And so it goes on.

So what's an Estate to do? Pac's gone, Afeni's gone, Johnny, who due to his knowledge and proximity was a key player in basically every posthumous release from 97-2006, also gone. Outlawz fractured. Tapes all over the place. Messy legal status, too many cooks. You could spend 3 million dollars shoring this up for an album, spend another million on marketing it and maybe break even.

Or you could sync "Changes" to a Hollywood movie for a million, and churn out a few limited edition vinyls and clothing here and there without any problems.

So go figure.

Does it suck? Absolutely. Do I get it? Yep. That's the way it is, things will never be the same.
 
Here's the thing. Posthumous Estates are harrrrrddddd to manage. I am close with the people running the Prince Estate - I was hanging out with them in Minneapolis in 2019. You wouldn't believe the amount of shit they have to deal with, and that's even with having a more fastidious overview of assets, since Prince had all his masters stored at Paisley Park, it's not like the Pac situation where who even knows where tapes, reels and other assets are.

And although they continue to generate vast amounts of revenue, the Michael Jackson Estate is a complete joke of mismanagement, shitty remixes, and consistently bizarre decisions.


And ironically enough, for all of them, actually releasing music is often not the top priority (credit due to the Prince Estate who have excelled at actually putting out a BUNCH of stuff in the last few years and doing it properly and respectfully). That's due to the state of the music industry. Mostly, they'll make more money licensing a song to be used in a movie than they would make from an entire posthumous album project. It's not uncommon to make a million dollars or more from ONE song being used in big movie or an advert.


The other thing is that with Tupac there's always multiple parties involved. The producers of the songs, for a start. Generally they want to get them remixed, so you need to make sure you're square with say, Capucine Jackson (Johnny's widow, who is a lovely person), as well as organising the right producer to remix it, as well as any features that might be on it. Then you've got problematic people continuing to throw lawsuits into the mix over any given song - for example, even after losing the catalog, Death Row continued to try and serve injunctions about various songs for years. They might not have legal rights to anything, but you can bet that Yaasmyn Fula will have her voice heard for anything that Kadafi was on - Fatal's family? Maybe Napoleon doesn't want certain things released because he's a Muslim now, no more dope game. And so it goes on.

So what's an Estate to do? Pac's gone, Afeni's gone, Johnny, who due to his knowledge and proximity was a key player in basically every posthumous release from 97-2006, also gone. Outlawz fractured. Tapes all over the place. Messy legal status, too many cooks. You could spend 3 million dollars shoring this up for an album, spend another million on marketing it and maybe break even.

Or you could sync "Changes" to a Hollywood movie for a million, and churn out a few limited edition vinyls and clothing here and there without any problems.

So go figure.

Does it suck? Absolutely. Do I get it? Yep. That's the way it is, things will never be the same.

Thank you for this, I knew you would have some knowledge on it. It is all such a mess. But what you are saying makes complete sense.
 

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