Technology Android

[dilla]

LOL!! Soon as I switched tabs......

http://www.tweaktown.com/news/32086/moto-x-google-edition-is-coming-soon-/index.html

Because fuck you, that's why.

 

[masta247]

I wonder how much it'll cost, haha. It'd be hilarious to see it priced higher next to the Nexus 4.

Meanwhile, Anandtech's take on the Moto X:

The rumor and buildup led me to believe that Moto X would be priced like the midrange device the silicon inside misgives it for, but at $199 on contract it's priced just like a flagship halo phone with a quad core SoC. I realize specs aren't the be all end all for everyone, but I was hoping the Moto X would be the realization of an Android for the masses movement and platform direction from Google with the price to back it up, which would've been $199 with no contract. I have no doubt we'll see the Moto X move down in cost quickly, and it's premium, it's just surprising to see $199 out of the gate for what is a midrange platform (8960Pro) right now.

I need to spend more time with the Moto X to really pass judgment. I've popped my personal SIM in and will use it as my daily driver for a while and give it the full review treatment.

 

[dilla]

How does a site like Anandtech make money? Just off of site hits? And these devices they get, manufacturers send it to them just to test or to keep as well?

Random question, I know, but I never really thought about it.

 

[Pittsey]

If the next Nexus phone is made by Samsung... I won't be getting it. The Nexus S was shit compared to what Samsung released a few months after, so was the Galaxy Nexus.

 

[masta247]

How does a site like Anandtech make money? Just off of site hits? And these devices they get, manufacturers send it to them just to test or to keep as well?

Random question, I know, but I never really thought about it.

Huge sites like Anandtech get hardware for free to keep - as example they got Moto Xs to use as their daily drivers and use for testing at the same time. The site makes money off ads, while some writers have other jobs.

Smaller tech sites only get rented phones. Each manufacturer has some phones to give away to sites with most hits and also those to rent for reviews to smaller sites. Sometimes resellers rent phones for reviews for a mention in a review like "device provided courtesy of shop X".

Almost all sites earn money from ads.

If the next Nexus phone is made by Samsung... I won't be getting it. The Nexus S was shit compared to what Samsung released a few months after, so was the Galaxy Nexus.

If it'd be technically similar to the S4 or better, with Nexus-style design and priced at 300-400$, I guess it'd be extremely hard to get one because people would go crazy about it. But I doubt they'd do that having the Google Edition S4 for 649$. I guess it's not going to happen. And sure, the S5 would be out 6 months later or so and it's still going to be much better than any Nexus phone that comes out this year, it's always like that.
I'm kinda afraid the next Nexus phone is going to be made by LG or Motorola. Personally I think Sony deserves a shot now (they just need to start using better displays because the ones they use in their phones are shit), and I'd like to see a HTC Nexus again, although in turn their cameras are disastrous

 

[THEV1LL4N]

I agree that Sony should get to make the next Nexus.

 

[dilla]

The cameras on HTC phones are bad? Aside from the One being kinda weird in its technology, aren't HTC phones towards the top with their cameras?

 

[ARon]

Every camera has it's pros and cons. HTC One is just odd lol.

The Moto X has a very interesting camera though. I'm eager to see reviews for it

 

[masta247]

The cameras on HTC phones are bad? Aside from the One being kinda weird in its technology, aren't HTC phones towards the top with their cameras?

No, lol. HTC phones were historically known to be good but had terrible cameras and battery lives (and some would say UI and price considering cheap labor in HTC's home country). They finally managed to fix the battery life issues with HTC One's release as it seems, but not camera.
Last year HTC started actually marketing for their crappy cameras and I always shook my head at some of the newbie website reviews comparing HTC One X's camera to SGS3's camera. I was like.. God, they have no clue what they're talking about. This year the difference is even much bigger.

Here you can peep yourself how HTC One's camera compares to the competition:
http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=1&idPhone1=5313&idPhone2=5125&idPhone3=5204

You can even scale it down to 3mpx there if you want to make it a tiny bit more fair. I mean, I can't believe why some people say it's not bad, lol. It's not bad for Facebook or Instagram, or take a quick pic to show heavily downsized, but it's way behind everyone else. If you're buying an HTC phone you're probably getting a good phone but you have to forget about good camera and don't hold your breath for official updates (even last year's HTC One S is no longer supported, it just got a buggy 4.1 update).

The point in why I want a HTC Nexus phone is this:
Google's influence would fix the update issue, price issue, crappy ui issue and probably make HTC use a reasonable camera and Google's enginners would be responsible for picture processing, which utterly sucks on all HTC phones in history (a small point for decent colors though).
In worst case we'd get a somewhat heavy device with an average camera, but judging by the HTC One it would look good, have a good screen and other components would also be very reasonable - some are second only to Samsung's flagships. LG's hardware engineering prowess is far inferior. Sony still has its issues with component choice (shitty screens). That's why I think HTC needs to be allowed to make a good Nexus phone. I believe it could be very good.

 

[dilla]

No, lol. HTC phones were historically known to be good but had terrible cameras and battery lives (and some would say UI and price considering cheap labor in HTC's home country). They finally managed to fix the battery life issues with HTC One's release as it seems, but not camera.
Last year HTC started actually marketing for their crappy cameras and I always shook my head at some of the newbie website reviews comparing HTC One X's camera to SGS3's camera. I was like.. God, they have no clue what they're talking about. This year the difference is even much bigger.

Here you can peep yourself how HTC One's camera compares to the competition:
http://www.gsmarena.com/piccmp.php3?idType=1&idPhone1=5313&idPhone2=5125&idPhone3=5204

You can even scale it down to 3mpx there if you want to make it a tiny bit more fair. I mean, I can't believe why some people say it's not bad, lol. It's not bad for Facebook or Instagram, or take a quick pic to show heavily downsized, but it's way behind everyone else. If you're buying an HTC phone you're probably getting a good phone but you have to forget about good camera and don't hold your breath for official updates (even last year's HTC One S is no longer supported, it just got a buggy 4.1 update).

The point in why I want a HTC Nexus phone is this:
Google's influence would fix the update issue, price issue, crappy ui issue and probably make HTC use a reasonable camera and Google's enginners would be responsible for picture processing, which utterly sucks on all HTC phones in history (a small point for decent colors though).
In worst case we'd get a somewhat heavy device with an average camera, but judging by the HTC One it would look good, have a good screen and other components would also be very reasonable - some are second only to Samsung's flagships. LG's hardware engineering prowess is far inferior. Sony still has its issues with component choice (shitty screens). That's why I think HTC needs to be allowed to make a good Nexus phone. I believe it could be very good.

Then why not just hope for a Samsung Nexus, then? The S4 Play Edition got 4.3 just now. It may not be a Nexus device by name, but by benefits, it kinda is.

 

[masta247]

Then why not just hope for a Samsung Nexus, then? The S4 Play Edition got 4.3 just now. It may not be a Nexus device by name, but by benefits, it kinda is.

Because HTC are struggling to keep themselves alive. HTC One was their last shot to keep themselves alive. The company has basically one product now and a spin-off - the HTC One, and now the One Mini, which has pretty big profit margins set hoping to keep the company alive for another year. I'm not counting phones such as HTC Butterfly that sell a couple of thousand units because they're tied to a small market and only cost them extra money.
Sony, LG, Samsung - they all make money on all kinds of different products. HTC only rely on Smartphones. No smartphone sales profits, no HTC. No matter if you like their phones or not, they're often the only serious competition to Galaxy flagships, and a little competition is always good for the buyer.
They're not even supporting last year's models by now, as it's too expensive - despite the fact that their hardware is still more than adequate (the HTC One S had similar components to the Moto X that is only being released now as a premium phone and it's being left with buggy 4.1).
Samsung doesn't need any help and I doubt they'd sell a SGS4-like pure Nexus device for much cheaper since it appears people are easily willing to pay 600$ for the S4, and Samsung's financial situation is better than any other company in the smartphone business second only to Apple, and it's not a far second right now. In fact the popularity they have begins to hurt them now, as they're being hated on for no reason, just for being the market leader they rightfully deserve to be.

Nexus 4 kinda placed LG on the serious smartphone map again, a Nexus device could potentially do the same for HTC, and I think their device would be pretty cool, cooler than a LG-made Nexus. Also, people love an underdog that strives to push forward, they'd support the device even if it wasn't the best.
While personally I'm sure a new Samsung made Nexus would be great, they don't need it and I'm sure already having the best hardware in business they wouldn't really care enough to make it anything different from what they have now . Even if they agreed to make an affordable high-end, in best case it'd essentially be a cut-down SGS4 with Nexus-design. HTC might have it harder, but they might be willing to push harder to make it stand out.

 

[Pittsey]

I'd like to see HTC come out with a brilliant Nexus. One subsidised by Google. Otherwise they could end up disappearing.

 

[dilla]

So Google is like a DJ promoting a new artist, trying to build some hype for it in the hopes that they'd take off? On one hand, Android was "good" because it inspired competition between the manufacturers to listen to what buyers wanted instead of deciding for them like Apple, but now that a company has been hurt by its poor decisions, it should be saved? If no one bought into the One's shiny aluminium body and shit camera, it doesn't mean Google should give it a second chance with a Nexus device in the hopes of jumpstarting the company.

Let the company fall, no matter how nice its products look. It'll scare other manufacturers to not put shit products out, like Motorola is doing again. Let HTC dig itself out of the hole it put itself into by silly investments, like the Facebook phone. Wasn't the Sidekick remake by HTC? I can't remember, but I thought I remember reading that they had some connection to it.

A Nexus device should be the phone with new OS features, but also new hardware features as well. You really think HTC is gonna shape up their camera-game, if their cameras suck right now? They have nice screens, but outside of that, none of their phones have brought new technology to the table. They were still the suckers that put trackballs on their phones into 2010 and then replaced them with even dumber sensors.

Give the Nexus phone to a manufacturer that knows how to make a quality phone. Otherwise, it's not a Nexus. It's a lifeline for floundering companies.

 

[masta247]

Eh, I don't really know what to think of HTC at this point. I know they are capable of making cool stuff, they're just making some bad decisions that spoil otherwise good products. Kinda like Sony making perfect value for money phones and using shitty displays. It has to be said that otherwise Sony stepped their Android game up a lot and there''s no other phone company on the rise like they are right now. I'm almost entirely sure that next year they will have a phone seriously competing with a Galaxy flagship (athough it's said to be made of different materials and in entirely new design language).

LG is the most mediocre brand in the Android world, and yet they were given a shot with the Nexus 4 and other than its bad battery life and mediocre camera the phone was awesome value for money and one of the best Android phones for a longer while.

The super silly thing I can't comprehend is that they were amongst the first ones who came up with IPS displays and they're good at making them (they power iMacs etc.) and yet they somehow manage to epically fuck up when it comes to using them themselves. They're not bad, but nowhere as good as they could be. It's like they have great potential, but use 0% of it.

 

[dilla]

I understand that. And the companies you mentioned wouldn't be as big as they are now if they weren't doing something right at some point. But to me, the Nexus name denotes that the phone is a functional prototype of technology that will be introduced to Android phones in the future. It should be cutting-edge. It should be the flagship phone for Android. Meaning that when it comes out, it shits on everything else in almost ever category. Otherwise, why make a Nexus phone? To get updates first? I can root and get the update in a week. It should be a top-notch phone whose specs and performance should not be matched for about two months after its release.

All this focus on affordability is crap. The N4 was a solid phone and it was, what, $299? Charge me $400 for an off-contract phone. It'll be cheaper than any other phone out there, but use good parts. Good camera, strong and efficient processor, great screen, etc.

If HTC can't supply that, then fuck them. Fuck every manufacturer that doesn't want to step up to the plate and create just one great phone and let their other phones be shit, budget phones. You can still stay afloat making bargain bin devices. But don't expect to be taken seriously.

HTC is in a different situation in that their phones are good, but they always fuck one thing up that prevents it from being a serious competitor in the market. That's why the S3 and 4 shat on the Ones.

If Samsung has the best hardware, give them the next Nexus. Give other manufacturers another year to prove that they have something that holds a light to the S4 or 5. Then decide again on the Nexus device. It wouldn't be fair to throw a struggling company a bone, when there are other companies out there struggling. That drive for competition will be gone and it'll further divide Samsung from the rest of Androids OEMs.

 

[Pittsey]

But if Google don't share the Nexus brand around to different companies and give it to Samsung every year, aren't they becoming too similar to Apple?

I don't want a Samsung phone any longer. They are the new Apple. Spend a gazillion on marketing and everyone has an S3 or an S4. I don't like being the same as a the majority...!

It won't encourage me to go to buy another phone. I'll keep the N4 for another year...!

 

[masta247]

Yeah on one hand I'd like the Nexus device to represent the best hardware, on another hand I think variety is always best, so I'd like it if a different company was given a shot every year. It'd be cool if there were some sort of awesomeness criteria you have to reach though, so we don't get a ZTE Nexus at this point. So far it was changing with 2-year cycles, so each company had 2 shots. HTC already had theirs, Samsung too, and judging by how things were LG will have one more Nexus this year, while probably Sony or something will have a Nexus next year.

I like Samsung because they have the best hardware. Them becoming a market leader was a truly deserved position. From the very first Galaxy S, they had the all-around best phones. They were always using the best displays, the best chipsets, the best audio chips, the best cameras and their phones had the best battery lives and were somewhat thinner and lighter than competition while being durable. Oh and they supported their phones like no other company. Even Touchwiz came from an annoying and not so pretty skin to a pretty solid UI with lots of functionality enhancements and performance optimizations.
I don't have any issues supporting the best OEM as long as it pushes the best phones. But.. there's that little commie part in me wishing to give falling companies a shot, if they have potential. As far as I'm concerned the more good players in the game, the better.

 

[masta247]

On a side note Nokia came up with their first really good Smartphone since the Symbian era. The Lumia 1020. It's held back by Windows Phone, but if it was running Android, it'd be competing with the top dogs and since it's all around good and its camera is absolutely groundbreaking and shits on all others I'm sure lots of people would get it. The way things are, it's not going to sell because of its OS. It makes me think that Elop is still not giving a shit about Nokia and only about Microsoft, which is his past employer.
Realistically WP won't gain more than 5% of global market share by way things look, so Nokia being the major contributer are still going to lose money even with Microsoft's billions pumped into it. If Nokia kept on making WP devices but went for Android too, them being the second or third biggest player they'd still make so much more money, as Android's global share is almost 20 times bigger. Nokia's business decisions are ridiculous.

In the past they realized that Android was moving too fast and the argument was they will not be able to remain competitive there, but now with those Pureview Lumias with decent displays, they'd really be amongst the top players. People are not buying them only because there's nothing on WP and because they're kinda bulky, and geeks talk about how shitty they are, but that's mostly because of the OS they're running.

 

[Casey]

Hopefully LG get another Nexus, and it will be based on the LG G2.

 

[dilla]

Yeah on one hand I'd like the Nexus device to represent the best hardware, on another hand I think variety is always best, so I'd like it if a different company was given a shot every year. It'd be cool if there were some sort of awesomeness criteria you have to reach though, so we don't get a ZTE Nexus at this point. So far it was changing with 2-year cycles, so each company had 2 shots. HTC already had theirs, Samsung too, and judging by how things were LG will have one more Nexus this year, while probably Sony or something will have a Nexus next year.

I like Samsung because they have the best hardware. Them becoming a market leader was a truly deserved position. From the very first Galaxy S, they had the all-around best phones. They were always using the best displays, the best chipsets, the best audio chips, the best cameras and their phones had the best battery lives and were somewhat thinner and lighter than competition while being durable. Oh and they supported their phones like no other company. Even Touchwiz came from an annoying and not so pretty skin to a pretty solid UI with lots of functionality enhancements and performance optimizations.
I don't have any issues supporting the best OEM as long as it pushes the best phones. But.. there's that little commie part in me wishing to give falling companies a shot, if they have potential. As far as I'm concerned the more good players in the game, the better.

I can understand this. You can still have Google promoting other manufacturers, but keeping the Nexus brand name only for the best phone out at that time. You can still have stuff like the S4 and HTC One Play Editions, which aren't Nexus devices. They get the updates ASAP, which is cool, but Google didn't have a hand in developing them. The Nexus would be the one where Google talks to an OEM and mentions upcoming features they want to introduce. The OEM is then making a phone that would accentuate the OS. Be a dress that brings out the curves of the phone, you know? Tailor-fitted suit.

You don't need Google's permission to take your phone and NOT put your shitty UI on it. That was seen with the S4 and One Play. But they certainly wouldn't pass off as Nexus devices. If they were released in January and were released first as Nexus devices and then a few months later as their normal, usual devices, that would be fine. Because the S4 in January would have been groundbreaking, sorta. The S4 released months later was seen as just a minute update from the S3. Not an overhaul.

Putting this in a sports metaphor, Samsung has become the Miami Heat. The Alabama of college football. They've both won two straight championships. The consistently execute on a level higher than that of their competitors. You can't hate them for that. If someone can take them down, good. Go for it. It only drives competition more. But to put a cap on Samsungs success, well, you're only fucking yourself over. Meaning if Google were to deliberately snub Samsung for a Nexus device even though they have the best phone come early next year, then it may strain the relationship a bit. Samsung will still sell. But it would be a shit, bitch move. Let the struggling OEMs be pushed against a wall and see how they fight back and what with. If Google just swoops in and pulls them out of the corner, what will be the incentive for Samsung or any other big player to invest in better products?

You're right, Masta, it would be communism, in a sense, and we all know what Communism failed. It'll be the same situation in the phone market.

There are still Nexus tablets too. An OEM can try and unseat ASUS. Didn't ASUS have a shit Android phone? Ask them how their Nexus 7 is doing, though. There is literally no better 7" Android tablet out there and it even has a bigger name than its Nexus 10 brother. Let ASUS rest on its laurels after its recent tablet market success, and watch someone else dethrone them as the Nexus OEM.