Heaven DOESNT exist!

[Jokerman]

and people with faith do they not seek truth?

Not as much as they seek comfort, which was the whole point of what I said.

 

[EDouble]

believing and having faith in anything provides comfort but it is also a resolve and an extension to something or someone

 

[S O F I]

It's probably also evidence that you watch a lot of award shows with black people who out of cultural habit feel they have to thank God every time they win something.

50 Cent: "I want to thank God for inspiring me to write, "Smack Dat Hoe in the Fat Ass with a Fat Dick." In fact, God gave me that title. I was gonna call it "You're Beautiful" but God said, no, you want a hit, then Smack Dat Hoe." (Audience, which includes Shadows, cheers, their faith once more being affirmed)

haha that popped in my mind too when I read Shadows' article.

Shadows, read up on Max Weber's Protestant Work Ethic. In essence, it talks of capitalism being spurred on by the idea of a "calling" for Protestants and Calvinists. Basically, to satisfy God and be a good believer, their calling was to make money.

As far as rappers go, they get rich and can't fathom why that is so because it was so unreachable for them. So, it's not enough to thank their ambition, their talent, the environment, and random occurences (luck) that led to their succcess. To them, that's not enough. It can't explain why a poor kid from the ghetto has millions. He got shot five times and lived. It can't be possible he got lucky. It had to be a work of God. It's an easy way out, to attribute our success and health to the work of God because it makes us feel "chosen" and "special".

If you find comfort in religion, then by all means, I will not rain on your parade (much). But to use that comfort as a sign that God exists, well, fuck that.

 

[EDouble]

As far as rappers go, they get rich and can't fathom why that is so because it was so unreachable for them. So, it's not enough to thank their drive, their ambition, their talent, the environment, and random occurences (luck) that led to their succcess. To them, that's not enough. It can't explain why a poor kid from the ghetto has millions. He got shot five times and lived. It can't be possible he got lucky. It had to be a work of God. It's an easy way out

you can apply that to any one who says Thank God from health to food to fame to fortune to redemption. there's also 'God blessed". its not automatically a cop out to ever defer credit for it and the reasons for it when others try but dont succeed

edit: theresalso people who forget to acknowledge God once they find success when they may have before. but in either case, it doesnt necessarily mean they arent sincere. or when its constant
its funny to me that if u concede that some one is a believer, how you can set limits or analyze when they believe. like a person who doesnt announce that "God did that" in every circumstance is more or less of a believer

something that you can't touch isn't the 'easiest' thing to hold on to so i don't think it's the 'easy way out' ,but the 'comfort' or benefit,in having an extension of faith can be there.but it seems 2 be the argument v.d was making that its either All God and No Self Esteem or Self Esteem and doesnt Need God and i dont think thats a fair assessment at all

But to use that comfort as a sign that God exists, well, fuck that.

theres more signs that God is there than hearing that Religion can make you comfortable

 

[S O F I]

you can apply that to any one who says Thank God from health to food to fame to fortune to redemption. there's also 'God blessed". its not automatically a cop out to ever defer credit for it and the reasons for it when others try but dont succeed

The point I'm making is that people yearn for understanding. They need to "know" why something is the way it is. With religion, it's a short cut. Why didn't I die? God spared me. My health is good, "Thank God".Why am I so rich? God helped me. It's simply much easier for people to wrap their heads around situations that don't have clear answers.

In my language, there's a phrase often uttered, "Cuvaj se, i Bog ce te cuvati". It means, take care of yourself and God will take care of you. It's the biggest bullshit. Why? Because the reason you're being taken care of is because you're taking care of yourself, not the other way around. You're merely giving credit to God for the work you're doing. But it's also extremely clever and smart. Why? Because a person like you will point out that you don't know if God ISN'T taking care of you and then it becomes that same bullshit circular argument. That's why religion is powerful.

 

[EDouble]

He got shot five times and lived. It can't be possible he got lucky.

1 difference is that wasnt a random shooting, they were gunning for Pac. he didnt say Thank God I survived now i can keep selling records, its all making sense" it was a personal event for him
if some 1 is facetious in thanking God thats on them the same it's on them if theyre facetious in any other circumstance

 

[EDouble]

The point I'm making is that people yearn for understanding. They need to "know" why something is the way it is. With religion, it's a short cut. Why didn't I die? God spared me. My health is good, "Thank God".Why am I so rich? God helped me. It's simply much easier for people to wrap their heads around situations that don't have clear answers.

i think it's the opposite, non believers ridiculing believers because they think They have the answers that none of us have, and that when believers have Belief in an answer it doesnt count because its not the black and white answer for Them.

there are clear answers to "why am I so rich" you can trace the checks you can check your hours you can cross the Ts and dot the i's for "that bus just wasnt quick enough to hit me"

In my language, there's a phrase often uttered, "Cuvaj se, i Bog ce te cuvati". It means, take care of yourself and God will take care of you. It's the biggest bullshit. Why? Because the reason you're being taken care of is because you're taking care of yourself, not the other way around. You're merely giving credit to God for the work you're doing

the phrase goes along with the argument about All God or Don't need God. whether youre talking karma or God specifically your convictions and actions do affect, whether you knowingly live by the latter part of that phrase

 

[vg4030]

where did I mention some one who doesnt believe in theirselves?

what are we arguing?
the Bible being accurate in history or archeology -do you also not trust all history written by some guys and if its read by yourself or read to you by some other guys

OK. I understood about 10% of that post.

I didnt say they dont believe in themselves. Im saying they dont believe in themselves 100%. Which is true if they believe something else has power over them.

I didnt mention archeology at all.

 

[S O F I]

1 difference is that wasnt a random shooting, they were gunning for Pac. he didnt say Thank God I survived now i can keep selling records, its all making sense" it was a personal event for him
if some 1 is facetious in thanking God thats on them the same it's on them if theyre facetious in any other circumstance

he said "got shot five times and i'm still breathin, living proof there's a God when you need a reason"

Right?

God helped him survive because God saw a reason for him to live. It's the same point I just shortened it because I thought it was obvious. I guess not.

 

[EDouble]

I didnt say they dont believe in themselves.

you were assuming that they didnt have hope in theirselves "why not have hope in their self" and like I said why can't it be intertwined

I didnt mention archeology at all.

you dismissed the Bible as a book "read by a guy" which was written by "other guys"
unless you only read and trust your own books you would have to dismiss all books including in historical or archeological context the Bible

 

[EDouble]

he said "got shot five times and i'm still breathin, living proof there's a God when you need a reason"

Right?

God helped him survive because God saw a reason for him to live. It's the same point I just shortened it because I thought it was obvious. I guess not.

my point was you were deducing it to it being Luck like it was a random shooting. like i said it was personal for Pac and that's the way Pac looked at it; my line about Pac selling records was along the lines of u talking about "rappers at award shows" randomly thanking God or not being sincere. Pac was given a new lease that didnt just apply to his career

 

[Pittsey]

Religion is a multi-million dollar business. The religious leaders must thank god every day for their successes.

 

[Flipmo]

In my language, there's a phrase often uttered, "Cuvaj se, i Bog ce te cuvati". It means, take care of yourself and God will take care of you. It's the biggest bullshit. Why? Because the reason you're being taken care of is because you're taking care of yourself, not the other way around. You're merely giving credit to God for the work you're doing. But it's also extremely clever and smart. Why? Because a person like you will point out that you don't know if God ISN'T taking care of you and then it becomes that same bullshit circular argument. That's why religion is powerful.

Us Balkans are moronic bastards at times. And I love every minute of it.

 

[Jokerman]

In my language, there's a phrase often uttered, "Cuvaj se, i Bog ce te cuvati". It means, take care of yourself and God will take care of you.

We have a similar phrase in my language. lojmIt yIpoSmoH! It means, God looks after those wot look after themselves.

 

[Jokerman]

Since this thread is supposed to be about Heaven, check out what these two churches have to say about it to each other:

http://doctordavidtennant.tumblr.co...hes-located-across-the-street-from-each-other

 

[Flipmo]

lmao. That's great.

 

[cS bIsHoP]

Hardly any facts? LOL. Science is ALL facts and evidence. That is the point. As Sebastian said, that is a very ignorant thing to say.

There was no "Eve", LMFAO. They have bones and evidence of pre homo-sapiens (ie, the previous form of life we evolved from), from over 200,000 years ago. I did see some religious idiots claiming they found "the bones of Eve" from 6,000 years ago. Which clearly is a complete crock of shit, funny how they shut up when everybody else asked for some evidence or carbon dating.

And Christopher Langan is FAR from being "the smartest man in the world" lol. It's not even close. He has a high IQ. That's all. That's the potential for intelligence. Not intelligence itself. Technically he may have a higher IQ than Einstein, but if you believe he's smarter than Einstein was you'd have to be smoking crack. I didn't address that post originally because it was obviously laughable horseshit, but since you decided to repost it....

So you believe in god because your computer you thought was broken turned on? No, you had faith before that and you attributed random occurences to it.

I don't believe Christopher Langan is the smartest man in the world, either. But you were asking people to submit themselves to an IQ test, and well maybe I shouldn't have taken it so literally. You people seem willing to give the stamp of intellectual authority to anyone who denies the existence of god. I agree that there is no way that religion is true. But the existence of god is in no way a closed matter given the observable data. I can debate that if you wish..Schrodinger, Pauli, Jeans, Davies, Haisch, Jeans, and Henry all had/have mystical leanings, and I'm pretty sure none of us could even hold their intellectual jockstraps.



The case of ultimate origins is one that we should meet with humility, not callousness and arrogance.

 

[Tha_Wood]

i have a high IQ, i wouldnt do anything i say.

 

[vg4030]

you were assuming that they didnt have hope in theirselves "why not have hope in their self" and like I said why can't it be intertwined

you dismissed the Bible as a book "read by a guy" which was written by "other guys"
unless you only read and trust your own books you would have to dismiss all books including in historical or archeological context the Bible

The bible was written by guys who SAY it is the word of god. Archeology books arent written by people who SAY it is their word. It is based on facts and research and it is DEBATED and counter arguments written etc... It isnt taken as fact straight away.

And on the 'hope' thing. Why does it HAVE to be intertwined? Why cant they just believe in themselves ALONE?

 

[S O F I]

my point was you were deducing it to it being Luck like it was a random shooting. like i said it was personal for Pac and that's the way Pac looked at it; my line about Pac selling records was along the lines of u talking about "rappers at award shows" randomly thanking God or not being sincere. Pac was given a new lease that didnt just apply to his career

No, I was deducing it to being luck that he survived the shooting, not that he got shot. I don't have data on how often people survive five shots to the body like 'Pac did but it's safe to assume it doesn't happen all the time. That's where I included luck. Tupac called it a work of God, in a sense.