Stem Cells cure Blind Man

[Rukas]

There is some truth in what you are saying BUT that's not how history sees it.

Are you telling me that you believe some books, written from one group's perspective, over the truth? Sounds awfully Religious to me...

Go out into the REAL world and try, just try having a conversation with people about the positive things that the Nazi regime brought about, then tell me the reaction you get.

I actually did that over Xmas as I spent it with a bunch of Germans.

I know all about the economical advances that the Third Reich brought on.......but at the end of the day that shit pales and becomes insignificant when you take into account the genocide of millions of people, both in Russia and Germany.

This stuff is just splitting hairs anyway. And nobody remembers the people whose opinions sat in the shades of grey. Those people, the agnostics, etc, are just sitting on the fence because they are scared to have an opinion one way or the other most of the time. Scared to have an opinion that could potentially be viewed as controversial.

Or maybe they are just open minded about things they can not possibly know.

I believe what scientists tell me, but Im not the one proving these experiments I have to take them on face value with some faith.

Perfect example? All the global warming stuff that you believed as scientific truth has been proven to be bullshit and have been manipulated by SCIENTISTS.

Well, I don't give a fuck who I offend. If people want to get all angry at that, that's fine, but some of them are secretly wishing they could express their opinion the way I do, and many people tell me that in private.

You're just a dick about these types of things. I think you just like being seen as some type of rebel. Yep, your narrow mindedness makes you cool.

Fact.

Opinion.

 

[Bender]

I believe what scientists tell me, but Im not the one proving these experiments I have to take them on face value with some faith.

Perfect example? All the global warming stuff that you believed as scientific truth has been proven to be bullshit and have been manipulated by SCIENTISTS.

Philosophers > scientists

 

[masta247]

I think I have a better picture right now to what happens on this board.
I always perceived it as some sort of unconditional hate for everyone having any beliefs in any higher beings just for the heck of it, because they're idiots for believing.
The way I see it now is that extremists/religious fanatics I have never personally encountered are not rare in your environments and that they annoy you that much on a daily basis. So right now even thinking about keywords "religion, God, higher beings" builds up negative emotions that you unleash here on any occasion. However it's sort of misplaced as I don't see anyone manifesting his religious beliefs on this board, so anyone standing in any defense of religion is considered an enemy ("how can something represented by that asshole who annoyed me this morning be any good? Fuck you!"). Atheists probably get way more emotional to anything religion-related than anyone else.

It's like I used to act hearing about Ipods as they are shitty, more expensive and it's not rational to buy them and Sofi's argument that "it's about the way they make people feel" was something I couldn't understand.
At that point I used to feel negative emotions whenever I saw anything from Apple just because I had these Iphone/Ipod fanboys in my mind. Even if someone bought an Apple product because he liked something about it without talking much about it I'd tell him that it's shitty.
Right now I almost don't care. I guess I became an "agnostic" in that case :suspicious:

 

[Rukas]

masta screw you my Macbook owns.

 

[Casey]

Are you telling me that you believe some books, written from one group's perspective, over the truth? Sounds awfully Religious to me...

I never said anything about any books or anything like that. I'm talking about the general public consensus.

Or maybe they are just open minded about things they can not possibly know.

There is nothing that one can not possibly know. The depths of human knowledge is available if you know where to look and who to ask.

I believe what scientists tell me, but Im not the one proving these experiments I have to take them on face value with some faith.

It's not faith. You have every capability of reading all the research that the scientists make and deciding whether their conclusions are logical or not. You just choose not to.

Perfect example? All the global warming stuff that you believed as scientific truth has been proven to be bullshit and have been manipulated by SCIENTISTS.

That must be a "you" in a general sense. I have personally never offered my opinion on global warming.

You're just a dick about these types of things. I think you just like being seen as some type of rebel. Yep, your narrow mindedness makes you cool.

Your judgement is baseless. I'm the least narrow minded person you'll ever meet. I'm not a rebel because of the lifestyle that I follow or the opinions that I hold.....if that was my intention, I'd be a very different person.

As for you, SOFI, come to my city and we'll see who is a bad ass or not.

Now, does anyone have anything relevant to add or are we done here?

 

[S O F I]

Just speaking for me. I’m only an atheist when it comes to the belief in the God of the Old and New Testaments, the Quran, and any other named god any culture has ever come up with. I’m only an atheist when it comes to the personal God or gods people believe in. However, I’m not an atheist when it comes to the idea that something unknown is going on with life, the universe and everything. Perhaps some purpose to everything. I’m an agnostic to that. I’m open to it. But it has to make sense to me and not be contradictory, as most god-beliefs have been. So you can be an atheist and an agnostic at the same time. Only not for the same thing.

Alright, I'm glad we cleared that up because that was not the impression I was given. I certainly wasn't given that impression with Casey's tired posts of "omnipotent vaginas" and dinosaurs.

 

[S O F I]

Your judgement is baseless. I'm the least narrow minded person you'll ever meet. I'm not a rebel because of the lifestyle that I follow or the opinions that I hold.....if that was my intention, I'd be a very different person.

As for you, SOFI, come to my city and we'll see who is a bad ass or not.

Are you threatening me? LOL

Also, it's not baseless. I was given the same impression with your post. But I'm glad that you don't think you're a rebel for the views that you hold because you're not.

 

[S O F I]

Perfect example? All the global warming stuff that you believed as scientific truth has been proven to be bullshit and have been manipulated by SCIENTISTS.

NO.

You are referring to the e-mails that leaked.

Although the findings were "manipulated", the hard evidence for global warming still stands and isn't altered by what the scientists decided to omit. The e-mail leaks were used in poor judgment by skeptics as a piss-poor last resort attempt at diminishing the chance of an agreement on combating global warming in Copenhagen.

I really dislike it when people consult illegitimate media sources unbound by defined standards and professional codes of ethics.

But I agree with your overall point that you tried to put forward.

 

[Rukas]

NO.

You are referring to the e-mails that leaked.

Although the findings were "manipulated", the hard evidence for global warming still stands and isn't altered by what the scientists decided to omit. The e-mail leaks were used in poor judgment by skeptics as a piss-poor last resort attempt at diminishing the chance of an agreement on combating global warming in Copenhagen.

I really dislike it when people consult illegitimate media sources unbound by defined standards and professional codes of ethics.

There is more to it though.
New Zealand totally faked their climate data because it didn't support the "accepted" model. Britain did something very similar if not exact.

 

[Casey]

Are you threatening me? LOL

Also, it's not baseless. I was given the same impression with your post. But I'm glad that you don't think you're a rebel for the views that you hold because you're not.

No, I'm not threatening you.

I'm saying, you haven't any knowledge of any of the factors that would determine whether I was a bad ass, I was saying that if you observed my actual lifestyle within the city that I live in, that would be the best way for you to determine that.

You could also could have met me in Seattle when I offered that possibility to you on here 2 years ago when you were trying to throw shots at me in every other post you were making at the time :cheesy::cheesy:

Some might consider me a rebel, but not because of my veganism or atheism. As you said, I live in a liberal area when it comes to those things.

 

[S O F I]

There is more to it though.
New Zealand totally faked their climate data because it didn't support the "accepted" model. Britain did something very similar if not exact.

The leaked e-mails deal with the report done by the IPCC. From what I've read, data from New Zealand and Britain have very little to do with the conclusions the panel made. In fact, I didn't see Britain mentioned.

No, I'm not threatening you.

I'm saying, you haven't any knowledge of any of the factors that would determine whether I was a bad ass, I was saying that if you observed my actual lifestyle within the city that I live in, that would be the best way for you to determine that.

You could also could have met me in Seattle when I offered that possibility to you on here 2 years ago when you were trying to throw shots at me in every other post you were making at the time :cheesy::cheesy:

Some might consider me a rebel, but not because of my veganism or atheism. As you said, I live in a liberal area when it comes to those things.

I see, OK, fair enough. I was indeed referring to your online posts.

But yeah, I declined to meet up haha. Perhaps next time will be different. I'm awkward about these things although I did promise Duke I'd meet up if I'm in the Netherlands again.

 

[Casey]

When did you go to the Netherlands?

Anyway, I'll buy you a beer next time i'm in Seattle. I enjoyed the city the last time, I would like to go back and check out a few more things, only really did tourist stuff last time.

What's the nightlife like?

 

[Rukas]

The leaked e-mails deal with the report done by the IPCC. From what I've read, data from New Zealand and Britain have very little to do with the conclusions the panel made. In fact, I didn't see Britain mentioned.

From what I read, NZ and the UK have filed reports showing that the temperature is going up but when the raw data was analyzed it showed that in fact it had not.

What their scientists submitted:

What the raw data actually shows:

 

[S. Fourteen]

Damn those green energy companies and their oppressive ways.

 

[Jokerman]

The real problem with this climate data scandal is that now all global-warming scientists and their data are being tarred with the same brush. Meanwhile the ice sheets are melting before our very eyes and big industry is as happy as they can be. So let’s not play it safe and let’s take the side of the big polluters and Fox News and the Ann Coulters and Sean Hannitys of this world.

 

[Rukas]

The real problem with this climate data scandal is that now all global-warming scientists and their data are being tarred with the same brush. Meanwhile the ice sheets are melting before our very eyes and big industry is as happy as they can be. So let’s not play it safe and let’s take the side of the big polluters and Fox News and the Ann Coulters and Sean Hannitys of this world.

Agreed. But at the same time, Science, this infallible order of truth Casey would have you believe it is, shouldn't be making up results. That is the point. And if you believe everything they say on face value, even though they have been proven to be wrong, or flat out lying before, then you are believing them based on your faith in them.

At the end of the day everyone believes in something based on blind faith because no one knows everything for sure. You "know" these things because that is what you have been told, by science, Islam, or your parents, whatever, you're taking someone else's word for it.

Other planets are warming up too and if anything this Climategate shows me that we should be looking at the big picture here and not just blaming human pollution. Is there something bigger we should be worried about and solving?

 

[Jokerman]

At the end of the day everyone believes in something based on blind faith because no one knows everything for sure. You "know" these things because that is what you have been told, by science, Islam...

Wait, you’re comparing science with Islam? Science is based on experiments, not blind faith. Science has peer review. That’s why there’s been a debate in science on this issue long before this story broke. In science the truth eventually comes out if the science is repeatable, even by the skeptics in the field. But this is not about science, any more than the paleologists pushing a lemur off as the missing link was. It’s about individual scientists who are working on a politically charged subject. It’s more political science than science. The scientists in question are not representative for every other climate scientist, or any scientist for that matter, on the planet. And the studies that have been called into question are not the foundations of our concern about global warming. The theory does not stand or fall based on those studies.

Most of the global-warming naysayers do not hold that view because they understand the science. They hold that view because they either have hidden agendas which tie them to industry, or they have political ties to those people. Maybe if scientists didn't have that kind of political pressure on their areas of research, the weak ones wouldn't react by slanting data. But there's a difference between Science and scientists.

 

[S O F I]

From what I read, NZ and the UK have filed reports showing that the temperature is going up but when the raw data was analyzed it showed that in fact it had not.

What their scientists submitted:

What the raw data actually shows:

But that does not justify your comment, which was "All the global warming stuff that you believed as scientific truth has been proven to be bullshit and have been manipulated by SCIENTISTS."

The most widely cited report for proof of global warming is the IPCC report, mainly the one from 2001. I don't believe the data you quoted was used in the report and even if was, it wouldn't make the threat of man-made global warming fake because it's one report out of thousands.

 

[masta247]

Well, but most of us would pretty much believe in that. There are probably more things that were faked and we don't even know.
In the media that provide us with information about experiments and results I bet that a lot of them were faked. To really be sure that something is true we'd have to perform experiments by ourselves but since it's usually impossible we have to trust other people - rely on books, tv, the internet that often lie to us or twist facts they don't understand. Also, in science usually things aren't as easy the more you get into them.

With this specific report someone was lucky enough to hack and retrieve it.

 

[S O F I]

When did you go to the Netherlands?

Anyway, I'll buy you a beer next time i'm in Seattle. I enjoyed the city the last time, I would like to go back and check out a few more things, only really did tourist stuff last time.

What's the nightlife like?

I went in '06.

The nightlife is pretty good because it has something for every one and every kind of genre of music. Also, a lot of good acts come often. The downside is that last call for alcohol is at 1:30am lol but there are a couple of clubs open till the morning (but they don't serve alcohol after 2am).