Martial Arts

[masta247]

What you are saying about kenpo is pretty true. So far I learned a handful of knife / gun disarms, but waaay more multiple attacker stuff.
I have a question that always comes up in forums. Why do people jock Kick boxing? I fought a kick boxer and it was ok but nothing super spectacular. I think Kenpo is the best street fighting / hand to hand style, at least to me. People that watch UFC love kick boxing because thats what they jock..what do ya'll think?

Kick boxing is really good. I think that after all the best martial art just don't exist. There are total failures like aikido or tai-chi quan
but all martial arts have they use. No matter if ull grapple someone in jiu-jistsu, beat down with kick boxing or break a leg with submission wrestling. There is no point of talking which martial art is the best. We can only tell the good and bad points. If 2 students representing different styles would front there are only 3 things that would determine who would win. 1- fighter, 2- teacher who taught him, 3- possibility to use what he learned. Of course grappler would win in close combat or on the ground, thai boxer in close range too, taekwondo/kickboxer would win in long distance, not lettin enyone to get close, boxer would fight best with hands in mid range etc etc. But it also depends much on fighter and teacher. Taekwondo teacher (mine for example) may pay much attention to grapples and close range combat to teach how to act in such situations, grappler may learn how to fight in boxing gloves etc.
So there doesn't exist the best martial art and in my opinion ppl saying "that style is the best" are assholes and don't really know too much about real fight.

 

[fields316_2000]

Aint that the truth! Gracie went into the last UFC thinking that BJJ is exclusive martial art that is unbeatable...then he met matt hughes and got a black eye..

 

[PELLA]

In the second grade I took Kung Fu, but I stopped going after a few weeks cause it got boring.

hahaha :thumb:

 

[marc]

what makes you think that muay thai is good
Its just popular. Plus its not safe for the one using it.I've seen many situations when ppl kicking just broke theyre leg. Most stupid thing init is that u dont kick with feet.
I've had sparing with many muay thai students and they were nothing great. Theyre biggest strenght is hard trainings.
I've been on few. I've considered tostudy muay thai but when i saw that many techniques aren't too perfect and at last not too healthy i declined.
Of course they do nice low kicks and ankle/knee fight but it rarely comes in use. During fights they already get a KO before they can come close

I dont want to call your post bullshit, because its not that I would like to insult you, but it is bullshit.
I train MuayThai. I have trained Judo and Aikido when I was younger.
MuayThai is IMO the best martial art when it comes to street fighting. Of course it ALWAYS depends on the person himself, truth is, there is no best MA.
To say a kick with the foot is more efficient than with the knee or shin is absurd. MuayThai uses the hardest bones in the body such as knee, elbow and shin (and fists of course). You dont break your leg because of a kick just because its a MT kick.
True, the training is very hard, but why unhealthy ? Whats so special about it?
About distance and being knocked out before getting close.... Do I have to comment on this? MT uses distance (low.mid.high.kicks) and close combat (clinch, elbows,kicks).
I dont know who you sparred with, but to say MT is bad because you sparred with a few(or many??really?) MTs sounds strange to me.

I know everybody thinks his MA is the best, otherwise you wouldnt study it, would you? But please dont talk about MT like that, its just not the truth.

EDIT: I might have misunderstood your post about distance, did you try to say usually there is no close combat between MTs or between a MT and a non MT fighter?

 

[masta247]

I dont want to call your post bullshit, because its not that I would like to insult you, but it is bullshit.
I train MuayThai. I have trained Judo and Aikido when I was younger.
MuayThai is IMO the best martial art when it comes to street fighting. Of course it ALWAYS depends on the person himself, truth is, there is no best MA.
To say a kick with the foot is more efficient than with the knee or shin is absurd. MuayThai uses the hardest bones in the body such as knee, elbow and shin (and fists of course). You dont break your leg because of a kick just because its a MT kick.
True, the training is very hard, but why unhealthy ? Whats so special about it?
About distance and being knocked out before getting close.... Do I have to comment on this? MT uses distance (low.mid.high.kicks) and close combat (clinch, elbows,kicks).
I dont know who you sparred with, but to say MT is bad because you sparred with a few(or many??really?) MTs sounds strange to me.

I know everybody thinks his MA is the best, otherwise you wouldnt study it, would you? But please dont talk about MT like that, its just not the truth.

EDIT: I might have misunderstood your post about distance, did you try to say usually there is no close combat between MTs or between a MT and a non MT fighter?

Sorry for saying that muay thai isnt good. It is actually good but nothing special for me. About that distance.. I train taekwondo so we mainly train fightin in longer distance so muay thai students havent been feeling too good init. Ive seen few muay thai trainings because i considered it before because it got really popular. Also i wanted to try it out n sparred with few best students that were in that school n they were nothing special in my opinion.Also i have a friend that trains MT. I'm just saying its one of most deadly MA in close combat, n thats true. They train more with elbows n knees than me for example in taekwondo. But what actually pisses me off is when someone says its the best. My point is that no matter if someone trains Karate, Taekwondo, box, kickboxing, Krav maga, MT if he's got a good trainer n train for the same amount of time it will be really hard to point which one is the best. Probaby man with biggest talent would win.

I say MT is not healthy because of my friend. We have the same amount of trainings weekly (4 + fights) n while i'm coming back just "beaten up" he already had operation on his
shin (because of hardening nonesense), nose broken (because they been using some tape on theyre hands instead of gloves during sparings) and he also had major complications with is joints.
And yes in my opinion using shin during kicks is nonesense.
Its better to kick with youre feet.
There are many reasons. For example.. feet is located on the end of youre leg.. thats why speed of youre leg there is higher. Also it isnt healthy to kick with shin (hardening it is totally nonesence and make major problems with walking) Also while kickin with feet u have bigger range.
Plus on the street when u wear shoes u can kick using toes.

So after all i can't say that MT is bad because it isnt. Personally with my experience in Martial arts i just don't take MT as something special. It is popular mainly because in this hard times ppl search for hard MA. But it isn't better than kickboxing or whatever. It's just different. Also i dont like when someone says that something is better. It may be just different n better trained.

Also my close friend trained judo with some crazy sensei. He taugh them everything. He was also brown belt in BJJ and 2 Dan i Karate.
He taught them mainly kicks and punches, then Grapples.
So when he went on Vale Tudo tournament everyone was really surprised when they got theyre asses kicked by Judo student.
It brings a moral to the MArtial Arts discussion.

 

[marc]

But what actually pisses me off is when someone says its the best. My point is that no matter if someone trains Karate, Taekwondo, box, kickboxing, Krav maga, MT if he's got a good trainer n train for the same amount of time it will be really hard to point which one is the best. Probaby man with biggest talent would win.

i agree 100%. i was actually j/p in my other post, guess i forgot the smilies.
still, imo, shin >>> feet and i have always seen tkd as one of the most watered down mas. BECAUSE most dojos focus on the sports /tournament part of it (which is absolutely fine).

as you stated, it depends on the student, but still, sparring>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>katas, which is probably why so many people think karate is crap (most dont even realise there are so many different schools).

i didnt chose MT because its so popular around here - its actually not, because kick/thaiboxing is mostly done by pimps, and gang members and their associates - it really has a bad name. thats a pity, because its such a wonderful arts.

 

[masta247]

i agree 100%. i was actually j/p in my other post, guess i forgot the smilies.
still, imo, shin >>> feet and i have always seen tkd as one of the most watered down mas. BECAUSE most dojos focus on the sports /tournament part of it (which is absolutely fine).

as you stated, it depends on the student, but still, sparring>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>katas, which is probably why so many people think karate is crap (most dont even realise there are so many different schools).

i didnt chose MT because its so popular around here - its actually not, because kick/thaiboxing is mostly done by pimps, and gang members and their associates - it really has a bad name. thats a pity, because its such a wonderful arts.

yeah i would definately choose MT over kickboxing because it has its tradition. Kickboxing was formed in like 70s taking best techniques from box, taekwondo n karate.

Yes many tkd sections are focused on tournaments especially WTF and other modern options of tkd.
We mainly focus on fights. Taekwondo in its original form was ment for that. Thank God that im learning that one.

And i will stand at my opinion feet>>>>>>>>shin

Edit: I forgot to say that KAta's are really good. I always thought they totally suck but they're nice because its easier to learn harder things in Kata's. But hopefully we dont train them too much with my trainer. I personally don't like them that much too.

 

[Glockmatic]

taekwondo has very little use in a street fight, the only opportunity to do a lot of damage is in the first few seconds of a fight when your opponent is a few feet away, but after that most fights are close range, where a kick (with your foot) would be of little use. Muay thai has many scenarios where it would prevail in a street fight. A person goes in for a up close fight, shin kick his knee, thai-clinch then knee to the face until the win. Of course thats my opinion

 

[masta247]

taekwondo has very little use in a street fight, the only opportunity to do a lot of damage is in the first few seconds of a fight when your opponent is a few feet away, but after that most fights are close range, where a kick (with your foot) would be of little use. Muay thai has many scenarios where it would prevail in a street fight. A person goes in for a up close fight, shin kick his knee, thai-clinch then knee to the face until the win. Of course thats my opinion

o course taekwondo teaches also how to fight in close range. TKD student will be good enough to kick ass of typical street brawler.
MT however pays more attention to it.
Also it doesnt matter if u kick someones knee using shin or feet. Results will be the same - terribly broken leg for the one kicked

 

[masta247]

Alright the other thing we gotta say is..
it does mainly matter if u train for sport or streetfight.
There are sections concentrated on sports but also on streetfights.
Many of them teach ppl how to act in both. Its the key to find it.
I dont like when someone says that one MA is good on the street and the other isnt. It does depend on the section.
Yes.. if u take sport aspect n u think about sections that are teachin students to fight on tournaments then MT, BJJ, Kickboxing, Most MMA etc students would be prepared to fight better because taekwondo, karate, kung fu etc students would be doing mainly katas, kicks totally unusable in battle or woudl have too many possibilieties dissabled. BUT it does count only in sports aspect.
If u take 2 different MA sections that are preparing students to sports n real fights then it wont really matter if its kickboxing, MT or karate or whatever. They got different techniques n different solutions but results will be the same or nearly the same. It would just depend on trainer n student.
If it comes to sports then MT would beat Taekwondo in street fights because TKD sections that are just for sports are really just good for shows. It just looks good but its the other story. I would never train something like that. It's like tai-chi in kung fu.
Thats why i think ppl are easily mistaken by stereotypes of martial arts.
The same if it comes to kung-fu. I hate when ppl imagine it at last stupid. They think of ppl looking like downs makin stupid moves n shouting all the time. There are reaaaly many Kung-fu styles. And i can assure you that most of them doesnt look like ppl imagine. They were made for something - for fight. So most of them also does what it was made to in fight