Are you British Enough?

[jaimie.uk fan]

Im fairly sure that they were actually born in the UK, therefore this has no relevance to this argument. These people would never have been subject to your test. Even if they were im sure they would just lie.

The test was tougne in cheek , anyway who trained and influenced those guys they were not born like it , and ill say it again if didnt like it here leave simple , why kill innocent people ?

im sure everyone agrees that you should respect the society you live in. But let me say that everyone has the right to protest against the governments preposterous policies, no matter where they are from. Immigrants have rights too ya know. Obviously those preachin hatred should be punished. But they are a minority who the media seem to be obsessed with, making the situation seem worse than it actually is.

Yes everyone has the right to protest , not blow people up , again leave if you do not like it here , why stay , go back to where they come from . These guys are also protesting death to the west and encouraging the killing of innocent people , not moaning about income tax .

What about those UK born citizens preaching hatred, what punishment should they face?

I personaly would string them up , but the goverment should kick them out , simple fuck their human rights - zero tolerance , what about the rights of the people they conspire to kill ??

also whats you definition of preaching harted, im sure it will differ among everyone, making your policy difficult to enforce.

This deinition enough www.jihadwatch.org/archives/001725.php

believe it or not these women you speak of are more free that most western women. They don't feel the need to dress like sluts in order to feel good about themselves, but obviously to you wearing a hijaab= oppression.

Good for them and if they want to live in peace and enjoy living here then they should be welcomed if not they can leave too .

I think your the one with the teenage views. Don't just believe everything you read in the papers. Maybe you should actually talk to some muslim women and educate yourself.

I have very strong views on this , even to the point of arrogance and which could be seen by some as racist which i make no appologies for - Simple you do not want to live here leave , black , muslim , white whatever - fuck off - do not kill innocent people .

 

[Illuminattile]

believe it or not these women you speak of are more free that most western women. They don't feel the need to dress like sluts in order to feel good about themselves, but obviously to you wearing a hijaab= oppression.

How can they possibly be "more free" when their choice of clothing is restricted?

 

[tupacmansion]

How can they possibly be "more free" when their choice of clothing is restricted?

Im sure that wearing a hijaab isn't obligatory in Iran. Its just that they live in a more moderate society. And being free isn't about what you wear.

 

[Illuminattile]

Im sure that wearing a hijaab isn't obligatory in Iran. Its just that they live in a more moderate society. And being free isn't about what you wear.

Funny, I seem to remember that when Jacques Chirac said that Muslim headscarfs were "non-essential", implying that they could be banned without compromising someones belief, that several prominent Muslim leaders and scholars spoke out. Islam dictates that a woman cover up, there's no choice there. Because you adhere to a set of religious rules, you are by definition less free.

And you said 'moderate', when you should have said 'conservative'.

 

[tupacmansion]

Funny, I seem to remember that when Jacques Chirac said that Muslim headscarfs were "non-essential", implying that they could be banned without compromising someones belief, that several prominent Muslim leaders and scholars spoke out. Islam dictates that a woman cover up, there's no choice there. Because you adhere to a set of religious rules, you are by definition less free.

Well Islam tells women to dress in a non-revealing manner, it doesn't blatently say wear a head scarf. It all a matter of interpretation of the Quran and peoples personal beliefs. I personally don't think its that necessary. But when you forbid people the right to make that decision and don't allow them to wear a scarf, your then affecting their freedom to choose. Thats exactly what happened in France and thats why these muslim leaders spoke out. As i said wearing a headscarf isn't essential to islam in my opinion, but people shouldn't have that choice dictated to them. Islam doesn't force anything, it guides you on whats right on wrong, whether you follow that guidance is your choice.
So saying that these women are less free is totally incorrect.

 

[Illuminattile]

Islam tells women to dress in a non-revealing manner

As I said, it restricts what women can and cannot wear.

Explain to me what you meant when you said that these women were "more free" than Western women.

 

[tupacmansion]

Islam tells women to dress in a non-revealing manner

As I said, it restricts what women can and cannot wear.


Explain to me what you meant when you said that these women were "more free" than Western women.

As do laws prohibiting women from showing their breasts in public. They just go by different standards. Also, Islam applies these same laws to men. But as I said, this has no restrictions as these women still have a choice as to whether to follow these rules.

When I say that some of these women are more free, I mean that they are liberated by the fact that they are not phased by the artificialities of todays western society where each woman must weigh a certain amount, look a certain way, get surgery in order to improve their looks. These women wear a head scarf and dress decently to show that they are independent and confident, and would rather be judged by their personal oppinions and whats inside then by how they physically look.

 

[jaimie.uk fan]

I may be wrong but muslim woman are considered inferior to muslim men are they not ??

 

[Illuminattile]

When I say that some of these women are more free, I mean that they are liberated by the fact that they are not phased by the artificialities of todays western society where each woman must weigh a certain amount, look a certain way, get surgery in order to improve their looks. These women wear a head scarf and dress decently to show that they are independent and confident, and would rather be judged by their personal oppinions and whats inside then by how they physically look.

This is the 'argument' that annoys me the most.

You can't say that, because women in strict Muslim countries are brought up in a conservative, restrictive culture in which they are expected (if not forced) to dress 'modestly', Muslim women are themselves more "liberated" and less superficial. If Muslim women had the same freedom that non-Muslim women do with regards to how they dress, and they STILL chose to cover their bodies, THEN you could maybe make that argument.

None of my female friends fit your description of Western women. They don't dress provocatively, starve themselves or undergo cosmetic surgery. They dress how they want to, they wear clothes that they feel comfortable in, clothes that they like. I value their personal opinions and "what's inside", despite the fact that they aren't covered from head to toe.

Maybe the problem isn't with the women, but with the men. Maybe you should ask yourself why you feel it necessary for women to be covered up before you can stop looking upon them as a source of "temptation" and respect them as a human being.

I may be wrong but muslim woman are considered inferior to muslim men are they not ??

You're not seriously expecting him to say "Yes" to that, are you?

 

[Helena]

I may be wrong but muslim woman are considered inferior to muslim men are they not ??

You are wrong.
where the fuck did u hear that? at yer local pub?
or was it in the sun?

 

[jaimie.uk fan]

You are wrong.
where the fuck did u hear that? at yer local pub?
or was it in the sun?

No silly little girl i heard from a sikh actually who is a friend of mine , he may be wrong or being a little predjudice as he is a little how do you say anti - muslium .

 

[Helena]

Silly little girl - I dont know what im on about ??

www.jihadwatch.org/archives/001725.php

This bastard lived in the u.k. off your mummy and daddys taxes preaching hate against the west - happy about this ??

Ask the victims or familys of the london bombings what they feel about the subject , if you remember the Fuckers that done that were from the u.k. if im not correct ?? Again i will explain , if people want to come to the u.k. and embrace are society , work hard and enjoy living in our free society what ever their creed or colour then they should be welcomed , if they want to live off the state preach hatred and in some cases kill , then they can fuck off back to where they come from. I feel very strongly about this and my opinion will not change , i couldnt give a fuck what people on this forum think about it either , maybe you need to go to Iran or Iraq and see how they live over there and see how the religon they preech so highly about suppreses woman , i think you would quickly change your teenage views .

Edit - i have just bought the sun news paper have a read .

foolish little man. u chat so much crap. The people who come to this country and do that shit are a MINORITY u fool and how would u know what their reasons are for coming here in the first place? Or is it that u think every other muslim man preaches hate? Have u been to Iran or Iraq? and even if the women are opressed...that aint the religion its the fuckin country!! Don't talk about the religion when u know fuckall about it.

No silly little girl i heard from a sikh actually who is a friend of mine , he may be wrong or being a little predjudice as he is a little how do you say anti - muslium .

what a fool

 

[jaimie.uk fan]

foolish little man. u chat so much crap. The people who come to this country and do that shit are a MINORITY u fool and how would u know what their reasons are for coming here in the first place? Or is it that u think every other muslim man preaches hate? Have u been to Iran or Iraq? and even if the women are opressed...that aint the religion its the fuckin country!! Don't talk about the religion when u know fuckall about it.

My point has always been if people want to live in this country in a free society peacefully then they should be welcomed , if not and they preech hate of the west and encourage the killing of innocent people then they should fuck off - simple . Please tell me which part of this is crap to you ?? I have never said that all muslims should go , i couldnt give a toss what religion peolple are as long as it doesnt harm anyone and effect my life they can dress in what they want , pray to who ever and good luck to them , and your right i do not know much of the religion thats why i asked the question .

 

[Helena]

people like that are around everywhere...people who were born and bred here think like that..what do u suppose we do about them jaimie?

 

[jaimie.uk fan]

people like that are around everywhere...people who were born and bred here think like that..what do u suppose we do about them jaimie?

If people do not lke it here or dislike are policys they should leave , everyone has an opinion and many have beliefs , its when they start killing people as a way of portraying thier opinions or beliefs thats when it is seriously wrong im sure you will agree . If they preech hate and encourage killing they should be slung out , these guys are not fucking around and neither should the goverment - zero tollerance . Again ill say if the want to live in peace then great if not out the door .

 

[Helena]

^^that applies to everyone and i agree with u. It's the fact that u pinpointed muslims out in your first post that pissed me off

 

[tupacmansion]

If Muslim women had the same freedom that non-Muslim women do with regards to how they dress, and they STILL chose to cover their bodies, THEN you could maybe make that argument.

yep, thats what im sayin, its obviously wrong to force someone into wearing a hijaab etc.. in my oppinion

None of my female friends fit your description of Western women. They don't dress provocatively, starve themselves or undergo cosmetic surgery. They dress how they want to, they wear clothes that they feel comfortable in, clothes that they like. I value their personal opinions and "what's inside", despite the fact that they aren't covered from head to toe.

None of my female friends are like that, but alot of women in general do feel the need to look a certain way through any means possible.

Maybe the problem isn't with the women, but with the men. Maybe you should ask yourself why you feel it necessary for women to be covered up before you can stop looking upon them as a source of "temptation" and respect them as a human being.

As I said before, it doesn't bother me Hijaab or not, nearly all my female mates don't wear a hijaab and i respect them. But if they choose to, then they should be allowed to, do you agree?

 

[tupacmansion]

I heard from a sikh actually who is a friend of mine , he may be wrong or being a little predjudice as he is a little how do you say anti - muslium .

Are you joking or are you a complete retard,
Do you base all of your knowledge upon what this predjudice sikh tells you? do you ever care to investigate yourself.

 

[Illuminattile]

As I said before, it doesn't bother me Hijaab or not, nearly all my female mates don't wear a hijaab and i respect them. But if they choose to, then they should be allowed to, do you agree?

Of course, that's why I'm glad we haven't followed in France's footsteps by banning this kind of stuff. Though I question the idea behind it, I have no problem with people wearing it if they want to. My town has a big Asian population so I see a lot of people walking around town in this kinda stuff. Reminds me that I live in a very diverse country. It's nice.

 

[jaimie.uk fan]

Are you joking or are you a complete retard,
Do you base all of your knowledge upon what this predjudice sikh tells you? do you ever care to investigate yourself.

from what i have heard he has every right to feel some predjudice towards muslims but thats another story and his choice . Now if you had read the post i made when i asked the question and said i may be wrong , now for the last time i will say , Black , white , asian , muslim whatever , if you want to live here in peace and embrace living in a free society wearing a head scarf , reading a holy book with green leaves growing from your arse then hey great , if you kill people hate our country or are not happy then fuck off - its simple and i feel strongly that the goverment should take tough measures to enforce this , not pusy foot around and worry about their human rights - fuck them , what about the rights of the people they kill ?? they are not fucking around and neither should we -zero tolerance , my original test thread was a dig at the goverment for being to soft on these preachers of hate not on muslims in general . How many times do i need to say this , are you retarded or can you see i have a very good point , im amazed people can argue with me on this and it makes my blood boil .