Technology Android

[Tha Massive Bell]

Thank you MacGyver!

 

[dilla]

LTT got hacked by those crypto scams lol poor guy.

It's incredible how much cheaper going the AM4 route (5800x3D/6950XT) is compared to the AM5 route. It's mostly the mobo and RAM that shaves like $200 combined from the final price

 

[Casey]

I'm looking at building something with the Hyte Y60 as well @dilla - but not for a couple months. Going out to NY and LA for a while first, and I need to land a new job so that I feel comfortable spending my severance money.

 

[dilla]

I'm looking at building something with the Hyte Y60 as well @dilla - but not for a couple months. Going out to NY and LA for a while first, and I need to land a new job so that I feel comfortable spending my severance money.

I was actually told by a few users on Discord that the Y60 might not be a good idea because of the way the GPU is mounted and that it would have very little clearance from the tempered glass. It kind of put me off of it, at least for my build.

Still looks sick.

 

[dilla]

Gonna try and get this to format correctly


PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 7700X 4.5 GHz 8-Core Processor ($499.00)
CPU Cooler: Thermalright Peerless Assassin 120 SE WHITE ARGB 66.17 CFM CPU Cooler ($37.00)
Motherboard: MSI PRO B650-P WIFI ATX AM5 Motherboard ($0.00)
Memory: G.Skill Flare X5 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL36 Memory ($0.00)
Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive ($59.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: XFX Speedster MERC 310 Black Edition Radeon RX 7900 XTX 24 GB Video Card ($1029.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Lian Li LANCOOL 216 ATX Mid Tower Case ($114.99 @ B&H)
Power Supply: Corsair RM850x (2021) 850 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($149.99 @ Best Buy)
Total: $1890.96
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-04-09 01:59 EDT-0400

I think I'll bail on the AIO cooler. And go with a simpler, cheaper case that still looks nice. Pricing on the mobo/RAM/CPU is $499 because of the Microcenter bundle deal, but I don't know how much longer that package price will last. I think we're at a month now since it was released? I'm hoping with the release of the 7800x3D, we see better bundles or prices dropping so much for the 7700x that bundles aren't necessary for those kinds of savings.

I have to have watched 20 hours of just step-by-step build videos from Paul's Hardware, Austin Evans, Tech Source, and Christopher Flannagan. The latter YTer is low-key really good for beginners and does a ton of testing on cases and their airflow with different fan setups.

I think I'm set on which parts I'll use. I just want to make sure I don't buy too early before another dip. Or, worst case, miss the dip and see prices go back up for some odd reason.

 

[dilla]

Any day now I'll be a decisive cunt. Until then, I think this is the final build loooool

PCPartPicker Part List: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/B9JdBj

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D 4.2 GHz 8-Core Processor ($449.00 @ B&H)
CPU Cooler: Deepcool LT720 85.85 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($140.98 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: Gigabyte B650 AORUS ELITE AX ATX AM5 Motherboard ($219.99 @ Best Buy)
Memory: G.Skill Trident Z5 Neo RGB 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL36 Memory ($124.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive ($119.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: XFX Speedster MERC 310 Black Edition Radeon RX 7900 XTX 24 GB Video Card ($989.99 @ Newegg)
Case: Lian Li O11 Dynamic EVO ATX Mid Tower Case ($159.99 @ B&H)
Power Supply: Corsair RM1000x (2021) 1000 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply ($188.99 @ Newegg)
Total: $2393.92

I still have to decide on case fans and whether to go RGB or not. I want some RGB on this build but not something that looks like rainbow cum.

I thought about the Lian Li Unify fans but they're all RGB and I need 7 fans. 3 for the side, three on the bottom and one for the rear exhaust. That's $230+ in just fans, which sounds dumb. That's Noctua money.

Or I go with the non-RGB fans from Arctic and get the PWM fans. Fan control still confuses me. I think my board has 4 fan headers, when I looked at the manual. I don't know how I'd get seven fans plus the AIO to work with that.

 

[masta247]

Responding sooo late, but did you pull the trigger? I just got the 7800X3D myself! Same RAM, except the CL30 version.

Some other things could be tweaked. You don't need liquid cooling. Can get something classic like one of the Noctua air coolers, or Scythe Fuma 2. You could get a better GPU and SSD for the price too, and PSU may be overkill. Reddit Build a PC could help too!

 

[dilla]

Responding sooo late, but did you pull the trigger? I just got the 7800X3D myself! Same RAM, except the CL30 version.

Some other things could be tweaked. You don't need liquid cooling. Can get something classic like one of the Noctua air coolers, or Scythe Fuma 2. You could get a better GPU and SSD for the price too, and PSU may be overkill. Reddit Build a PC could help too!

I did not. Some personal stuff came up and I put the idea of building a PC to the side. I still have the build saved on PCPP but it'll happen at a later time.

I struggled with the decision between liquid and air cooling. I didn't want to get a high GPU and an upper-mid-range CPU and try to tinker with settings only to realize my cooling was insufficient. I don't know what workload warrants a liquid cooler but I figured better safe than sorry. Otherwise, the Peerless Assassin is recommended all over r/BuildaPC and I can always go for that or a Noctua.

When I was at the end of my build list and ready to buy, I was juggling the 7700x and the 7800x3D and just opted to get the 7700x since it was part of the Microcenter bundle; but then I was wondering if the mobo was going to feel restrictive in a year or two once I dug deeper in to tweaking settings.

But that's just how I am. If I get a "cheaper" component and focus on the value to performance, I'll eventually feel restricted and look to upgrade soon after. If I shoot for the moon and get an overkill system with max specs, I'll feel like an idiot for using all that power just to play simple-ass games. It's going to happen where I will either have buyer's remorse for aiming too low or too high. I never hit the "just right" point.

Since I last looked at PC parts, Computex happened but I was not able to pay close attention to all the new stuff. I saw a few pictures of newer cases and fans released but still didn't look close enough to see if I want to update my build sheet. Maybe some time in the future

 

[masta247]

I did not. Some personal stuff came up and I put the idea of building a PC to the side. I still have the build saved on PCPP but it'll happen at a later time.

I struggled with the decision between liquid and air cooling. I didn't want to get a high GPU and an upper-mid-range CPU and try to tinker with settings only to realize my cooling was insufficient. I don't know what workload warrants a liquid cooler but I figured better safe than sorry. Otherwise, the Peerless Assassin is recommended all over r/BuildaPC and I can always go for that or a Noctua.

When I was at the end of my build list and ready to buy, I was juggling the 7700x and the 7800x3D and just opted to get the 7700x since it was part of the Microcenter bundle; but then I was wondering if the mobo was going to feel restrictive in a year or two once I dug deeper in to tweaking settings.

But that's just how I am. If I get a "cheaper" component and focus on the value to performance, I'll eventually feel restricted and look to upgrade soon after. If I shoot for the moon and get an overkill system with max specs, I'll feel like an idiot for using all that power just to play simple-ass games. It's going to happen where I will either have buyer's remorse for aiming too low or too high. I never hit the "just right" point.

Since I last looked at PC parts, Computex happened but I was not able to pay close attention to all the new stuff. I saw a few pictures of newer cases and fans released but still didn't look close enough to see if I want to update my build sheet. Maybe some time in the future

The 7800X3D is the fastest gaming CPU in existence, and it can be cooled by a low end air cooler. It's the better buy than the 7700X, unless you want to save (I'd much rather save on a CPU cooler though!). For gaming, the 7800X3D is so much faster that it'd likely keep you going for one additional generation without a need to upgrade, when you think specifically of gaming use cases. Both are almost indistinguishable for productivity.

If you go with AMD AM5, you won't need liquid cooling at all. Even the Ryzen 9 can be cooled by a mid-range air cooler and perform about the same as with the best liquid cooler, making fancy cooling a waste of money.

I'd get the Noctua NH-D12L (the bigger ones don't seem to fit in your case, but if they do, get the freaking D15S!). You'd be safe with any CPU up to Ryzen 9, and air coolers just work forever, with no funny business. Plus you will be able to move it to a future build since Noctua supports their coolers with mounting kits if needed. Which is why I'd spent on the Noctua - it could last you more than a decade, while liquid coolers are typically much more short-lived (sometimes in a destructive fashion, though they have improved a lot).

You can definitely consider a cheaper GPU - I don't think the 7900 XTX is a good buy. If you want to save a lot and still get a great GPU, last gen AMD (6000 series) are where it's at. The 6950XT is a steal!
GPUs are also the easiest to upgrade later once the need arises. Likely the GPU market will get less crazy by then.

 

[dilla]

The 7800X3D is the fastest gaming CPU in existence, and it can be cooled by a low end air cooler. It's the better buy than the 7700X, unless you want to save (I'd much rather save on a CPU cooler though!). For gaming, the 7800X3D is so much faster that it'd likely keep you going for one additional generation without a need to upgrade, when you think specifically of gaming use cases. Both are almost indistinguishable for productivity.

If you go with AMD AM5, you won't need liquid cooling at all. Even the Ryzen 9 can be cooled by a mid-range air cooler and perform about the same as with the best liquid cooler, making fancy cooling a waste of money.

I'd get the Noctua NH-D12L (the bigger ones don't seem to fit in your case, but if they do, get the freaking D15S!). You'd be safe with any CPU up to Ryzen 9, and air coolers just work forever, with no funny business. Plus you will be able to move it to a future build since Noctua supports their coolers with mounting kits if needed. Which is why I'd spent on the Noctua - it could last you more than a decade, while liquid coolers are typically much more short-lived (sometimes in a destructive fashion, though they have improved a lot).

You can definitely consider a cheaper GPU - I don't think the 7900 XTX is a good buy. If you want to save a lot and still get a great GPU, last gen AMD (6000 series) are where it's at. The 6950XT is a steal!
GPUs are also the easiest to upgrade later once the need arises. Likely the GPU market will get less crazy by then.

This is all good stuff. I looked at the build I listed on here a few months ago and realized I had changed it since then. I switched from the O11 Dynamic because it would require me to either buy a ton of case fans or leave some areas "blank" of fans which ruins the aesthetic of the build. And since the case is mainly about aesthetics and not necessarily the case with the most flow, I ditched the idea of the O11 now. As nice as it looks, aesthetics are one of those things that I feel I will pay a lot of attention to now but won't care after a month. So the case and case fans being dictated by aesthetics and spending more for RGB and stuff like that might give me some buyer's remorse soon afterwards.

I was debating bumping down to the 6950 since it's $600 at MC and a few other places. I thought if I was going for a $2200 build, I might as well get the best GPU (minus the 4090) and enjoy the extra VRAM for future-proofing. But I may go back from the 7900XTX to the 6950. I don't think I'd appreciate it as much until several years from now when the 24GB of RAM will be what keeps the GPU relevant at that point.

As amazing as the 7800x3d is, if the 7900XTX is overkill as a GPU, couldn't the same be said for me for the 7800x3d, as well?

Here is the current build I had from late-May: https://pcpartpicker.com/user/smackythefrog00/saved/DfFZQ7

I like the Fractal Design North and the Lancool III so it's a bit of a toss-up between those now. They look nice but aren't for showing off the internals, too much. So I don't have to worry about RGB-this and RGB-that.

And as much as I research mobos, I can still never decide on a simple one that will meet my needs and still be reliable. Kind of like the whole mess with ASUS last month with the BIOS updates that still voided warranties. I saw Hardware Unboxed made a video within the last day or two that did a round up of the B650 boards, so I might give it a look. I think I made my choice based on an older HU video.

Edit: watched the HU video. Couldn't keep my eyes open after eight minutes.

 

[masta247]

I don't think you'll need more than 16GB of VRAM for a good number of years, especially if you don't game at 4K. By the time it's needed, the 7900XTX likely won't be as fast as mid-range GPUs of that time.
I currently have the RTX3080 with 10GB of VRAM, game at 4K, and I'm yet to play anything that uses it all (there are only 2-3 poor ports that exceed that iirc). I'd feel future-proofed with 16, as even poor console ports won't exceed that as this console generation is incapable of exceeding that.

If you're getting a case that will fit them, the Noctua D15 & D15S are amazing coolers able to cool any CPU, including the hottest Intel CPUs currently on the market. So you'll be safe, it's extremely reliable, and comes with the long-term support of Noctua. Their website also diligently lists how well it cools different CPUs (it cools all, being the flagship Noctua cooler), and whether your case will fit them.

As for the 7700X vs 7800X3D, ultimately that depends on the price difference. The 7800X3D is like 25-30%? faster in games on average, with some insane outliers like this:

If the difference is like $100-200, I'd spend it as 3D cache is a huge deal. The 5800X3D still outperforms the 7700X in a lot of games despite being a whole architecture older, and with much lower clock speeds, being the first "experimental" X3D CPU. I think if you're buying a CPU primarily for gaming, X3D is a no-brainer, being likely the single most impactful gaming performance-boosting technology we've seen in the CPU space. Not only does it facilitate the delivery of much higher average FPS, it also smooths out the minimums, helping to eliminate stutters. This is what I appreciate the most about 3D cache - how it feels to "smooth" out the gameplay.

The 7800X3D is also the most power-efficient CPU on the market, which also means it generates far less heat in your case/room. It uses something like 50W when gaming while delivering the best gaming performance you can get today, which is incredibly impressive. You'll also get some bucks back in the difference in electricity bills.

 

[dilla]

As for the 7700X vs 7800X3D, ultimately that depends on the price difference. The 7800X3D is like 25-30%? faster in games on average, with some insane outliers like this:

The 7700x bundle from MC is basically the same price as the 7800x3d alone: https://www.microcenter.com/product...ries-32gb-ddr5-6000-kit,-computer-build-combo

The only concern I have is the motherboard included in that bundle and if it's going to cause issues. Not necessarily in terms of reliability but just with other parts, like RAM, where I've heard of people not being able to run their RAM at max speed, or something like that, because of their motherboard. Not necessarily this one, but various ones.

If the difference is like $100-200, I'd spend it as 3D cache is a huge deal. The 5800X3D still outperforms the 7700X in a lot of games despite being a whole architecture older, and with much lower clock speeds, being the first "experimental" X3D CPU. I think if you're buying a CPU primarily for gaming, X3D is a no-brainer, being likely the single most impactful gaming performance-boosting technology we've seen in the CPU space. Not only does it facilitate the delivery of much higher average FPS, it also smooths out the minimums, helping to eliminate stutters. This is what I appreciate the most about 3D cache - how it feels to "smooth" out the gameplay.

Sounds like it's good for people concerned with future-proofing without getting high-end-everything, when it comes to gaming.

I don't know if the mobo I had on my build sheet is fine for me or if it will be lacking some feature I don't know I need at this point.

 

[masta247]

The 7700x bundle from MC is basically the same price as the 7800x3d alone: https://www.microcenter.com/product...ries-32gb-ddr5-6000-kit,-computer-build-combo

The only concern I have is the motherboard included in that bundle and if it's going to cause issues. Not necessarily in terms of reliability but just with other parts, like RAM, where I've heard of people not being able to run their RAM at max speed, or something like that, because of their motherboard. Not necessarily this one, but various ones.

Sounds like it's good for people concerned with future-proofing without getting high-end-everything, when it comes to gaming.

I don't know if the mobo I had on my build sheet is fine for me or if it will be lacking some feature I don't know I need at this point.

Future-proofing too, but also to get a smoother gameplay experience throughout the life of the CPU.

That said, the deal on that 7700X combo is great. The mobo looks okay, just need to update the BIOS as soon as you put it together as it seems to be among a long list of those delivering excessive CPU_SOC voltage (what ultimately led to frying Zen 4 CPUs). BIOS updates should fix this.

You can also get this today and upgrade to the last 3D cache CPU supported on AM5 later on.


A thing to note about the AMD AM5 CPUs and CPU cooling, is that all the "X" series CPUs (like the 7700X, and even the 7600X) are limited by the thermal density of the CCD (the chiplet that contains the cores). This happens way before heat has a chance to reach the heat spreader of the CPU package to be transferred to a cooler. Meaning that the cooler quality doesn't significantly impact the CPU performance or lifespan, as the bottleneck is already within the CPU package.

Essentially, those CPUs are designed to reach 95C immediately once they start fully boosting their clocks, and adjust their clock speeds and voltages accordingly to keep the cores at ~95C. All a better cooler can do is cool the heat spreader, but it's a bit like trying to keep your working oven cooler by pointing a bigger fan at its sealed door. The difference between the lowest end and highest end cooler is a CPU clock speed difference of something like 5%.

 

[dilla]

The mobo looks okay

See, that's what gives me pause on getting the bundle. I'm attracted to the price, and the hardware seems to be decent parts and not some rejected crap that will fail quickly. But then I think if I get the XTX, a high end card, why would I skimp on parts in general and get this bundle when better parts exist for only about $150-200 more to the final price.

Like, there's a pleasure derived from saving money and getting the bundle and keeping cost low but then there's the point you made about the 7800x3d simply providing a better gaming experience and for longer.

Essentially, those CPUs are designed to reach 95C immediately once they start fully boosting their clocks, and adjust their clock speeds and voltages accordingly to keep the cores at ~95C.

So in a way, the CPUs are boosted to a temperature (95C) and not necessarily a certain clock speed?

The difference between the lowest end and highest end cooler is a CPU clock speed difference of something like 5%.

I've read something similar but in comparison to the best liquid and best air cooler. I think LTT did a video on this in the last two months.


One thing, other life, that kept me away from building ASAP a few months back was people saying that the GPU prices were going to crash. Not fall, but straight crash. It's been, well, two months since and I've seen the 7900XT and the XTX drop about $100 when on sale, but not much beyond that. The 6950 has stayed at a solid $600 at Microcenter. Which was an attractive price.....two months ago...but two months later, it hasn't budged.

I wonder when that 6950 finally drops below $600, since I bet stock is getting low and stores just want to get rid of last-gen AMD GPUs. Another $100 off and that stock is gone within a week, I bet.

Any advice on the RAM? I gather CL36 is decent enough for gaming and I'm still not quite sure what a lower CL will do, in terms of gaming.

I know of only two games that use Direct Storage but I still do double-check my NVME options from time to time.

 

[masta247]

See, that's what gives me pause on getting the bundle. I'm attracted to the price, and the hardware seems to be decent parts and not some rejected crap that will fail quickly. But then I think if I get the XTX, a high end card, why would I skimp on parts in general and get this bundle when better parts exist for only about $150-200 more to the final price.

Like, there's a pleasure derived from saving money and getting the bundle and keeping cost low but then there's the point you made about the 7800x3d simply providing a better gaming experience and for longer.


So in a way, the CPUs are boosted to a temperature (95C) and not necessarily a certain clock speed?


I've read something similar but in comparison to the best liquid and best air cooler. I think LTT did a video on this in the last two months.


One thing, other life, that kept me away from building ASAP a few months back was people saying that the GPU prices were going to crash. Not fall, but straight crash. It's been, well, two months since and I've seen the 7900XT and the XTX drop about $100 when on sale, but not much beyond that. The 6950 has stayed at a solid $600 at Microcenter. Which was an attractive price.....two months ago...but two months later, it hasn't budged.

I wonder when that 6950 finally drops below $600, since I bet stock is getting low and stores just want to get rid of last-gen AMD GPUs. Another $100 off and that stock is gone within a week, I bet.

Any advice on the RAM? I gather CL36 is decent enough for gaming and I'm still not quite sure what a lower CL will do, in terms of gaming.

I know of only two games that use Direct Storage but I still do double-check my NVME options from time to time.

Yes these CPUs boost to their max temp, always. With the exception of the 7800X3D that boosts to about 5050mhz as it's electrically-limited due to vcache, which is also why it's so efficient and cool.

The 7700X will boost to pretty much whatever the temperature will allow, the temperature bottleneck being in the tiny core complex itself, rather than the heat dissipation from the CPU as a whole through the cooler. The final 200-300mhz generate more heat than the 5ghz before it, which is why the difference in performance you see between coolers is so small. Zen 4 is extremely efficient up to around 5ghz, then it's a super-steep fall. So under turbo bursts you may see it reach, for example, 5.3ghz with a $50 cooler, and 5.4ghz with a $200 cooler. Not a difference you would ever notice.

As for RAM, any of the G.Skill 6000mhz options are going to be great. X5 or Z5 - main difference being the appearance of the heatsink, and market segmentation, with the Z5 having a SKU that goes one latency tier further. Otherwise they are exactly the same inside, using very good memory chips by SK Hynix.

CL30 will get you a few extra fps vs CL36 on the 7700X, but both should be about the same with 7800X3D (the 3D cache is big enough that it makes RAM speeds far less relevant, as the CPU rarely has frame data that it can't find in cache to need to seek in RAM, which is the time when RAM latency would matter for gaming performance).

 

[dilla]

As for RAM, any of the G.Skill 6000mhz options are going to be great. X5 or Z5 - main difference being the appearance of the heatsink, and market segmentation, with the Z5 having a SKU that goes one latency tier further. Otherwise they are exactly the same inside, using very good memory chips by SK Hynix.

So I'm fine with the CL36 I have and probably don't need to spend an extra $20-30 to get to CL30 for just a few frames, right? And that's just for the 7700x. If I go the 7800x3d then it's a non-issue.

Any recommendations for a mobo? I got a cheaper, Gigabyte one and I think it was one that fared pretty well in HU's mobo roundup from a few months ago (and not the most recent one in the past week). People keep telling me to get the cheapest one with the features I want; I don't know mobo "features" all that well. The only thing I can think of is it should have WiFi included and should have two, or more, USB-C ports since I may charge a device or two with the PC and I do have 2 Samsung T7 SSDs that use USB C. Will the fact that I use bluetooth headphones have any effect on the audio codecs I need? I don't use analog headphones or speakers and if I did I was told to just invest in a DAC.

 

[masta247]

Will the fact that I use bluetooth headphones have any effect on the audio codecs I need? I don't use analog headphones or speakers and if I did I was told to just invest in a DAC.

Nope, wireless headphones ignore the DAC on your mobo/device as they have their own.

I'm not as familiar with AM5 ATX mobos since for quite a while now I've been building ITX. But I'm a fan of Asrock mobos. I believe they were the only brand largely unaffected by the exploding CPUs fiasco. They tent do have the most reasonable feature combinations and quality components in each class. I'd consider them to be the boutique mobo maker at a price competitive with the mainstream.

I find the B650E chipset to be the best of both worlds, where you can save a buck, but still get PCIe 5.0.

Personally I really like the design of this one, it's cheap, but misses PCIe on the GPU:
https://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/10336/asrock-b650-live-mixer-am5-motherboard/index.html
And this is their most popular model, with PCIe 5.0 on both, the GPU and storage:
https://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/10350/asrock-b650e-taichi-motherboard/index.html

 

[dilla]

Nope, wireless headphones ignore the DAC on your mobo/device as they have their own.

I'm not as familiar with AM5 ATX mobos since for quite a while now I've been building ITX. But I'm a fan of Asrock mobos. I believe they were the only brand largely unaffected by the exploding CPUs fiasco. They tent do have the most reasonable feature combinations and quality components in each class. I'd consider them to be the boutique mobo maker at a price competitive with the mainstream.

I find the B650E chipset to be the best of both worlds, where you can save a buck, but still get PCIe 5.0.

Personally I really like the design of this one, it's cheap, but misses PCIe on the GPU:
https://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/10336/asrock-b650-live-mixer-am5-motherboard/index.html
And this is their most popular model, with PCIe 5.0 on both, the GPU and storage:
https://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/10350/asrock-b650e-taichi-motherboard/index.html

I'll take a look at those. I considered the Lightning or the Riptide from them, which ever one had WiFi included. I don't know why I switched from that to the Gigabyte one.

The 7900 XT is $700 at MC near me. Maybe it drops a lot more in a month or two. I haven't seen too much hype around the 7000 GPUs

 

[THEV1LL4N]

Has anyone used a VPN to purchase YouTube Premium, Spotify or any other digital subscription?

How did it go and were there any issues?
What are the risks? (e.g. account deletion)
Do you need to remain connected to the VPN at all times?
Do you have a family plan? If so, do they need to remain connected to a VPN as well?

Is there anything else to consider?

 

[dilla]

CL30 will get you a few extra fps vs CL36 on the 7700X, but both should be about the same with 7800X3D (the 3D cache is big enough that it makes RAM speeds far less relevant,

So spending more on the CPU means I can spend a bit less on a "higher CL" RAM and not notice the difference in performance of the slower RAM?

I'm tired of reading people shit on Nvidia and AMD for pricing and performance the past few years. It seems like people are still buying their newest offerings. I've lost track of what the shitt Nvidia 4000 series cards are now because there are so many recent releases and also so many recent videos being made shitting on them. Aside from the king of the hill, the 4090, sounds like the 4070 and below cards are everyone's favorite target. The 4080 performs well but the pricing is still an issue since it costs more than the 7900XTX but performs about the same, or worse, for $200 more.

So which side is "winning" right now? The consumers, who have a seemingly small portion of users that refuse to buy any new offerings from any manufacturer until prices improve for them? Or AMD/Nvidia who don't feel the pinch at all of releasing subpar offerings and either get consumers to still buy them or get people doing AI stuff to buy their GPUs at a wholesale level and still line their pockets?