Cultural differences between men and women ''nature or ''nurture''?

[Devious]

I don't know whether there is a set definition of what a woman should be like or not, but I do know that God created a woman to be a woman. Man to be a man. (women to be with men and vice versa. no I don't think God created homosexuals or lesbians, but this is a different debate). To me that woman is tender, romantic, soft that nourishes her children and takes care of her husband. Your justification of women these days are loud, manly and don't posses ''traditional values'' because they were forced to some circumstances that made them this way. I don't believe that. And you want me to respect women who are loud talking, dominant that don't posses any quality that a woman should have? No, I have no respect for this women.

as a human being you should have respect for all others unless they show disrespect to you. what does it matter if there are women like that? no one says you have to be with them. and not all women who aren't homemakers are loudmouth dominant bitches like you seem to think. to be honest, it seems to me that you want the kind of woman who will let you control and dominate her, the docile kind that wouldn't say boo to Casper the ghost. in fact, you sound like the type of guy who NEEDS to be in control of his woman. as far as i'm concerned that's not cool. a relationship should be an equal partnership between 2 people and not one controlling the other.

 

[Bachaveli]

see, i have no problem with what you said here, in fact i agree with most of it. what bothers me is when Bach says women who don't have that nurturing, caring side are going against their nature, which is to cook and clean and have babies and basically be a maid. i don't agree with that sentiment because it implies that all women were created for that purpose, and those who choose not to follow that are forgetting their traditional values. i will say it again, that's bullshit.

now there is definitely no doubt that women in general are more gentle and nurturing than men, but not all women are nurturing and gentle, nor should they all be. and i don't particularly agree with your sentiment that women lose some of that nurturing and caring part of them if they wait until they are older to have children. in fact most women who pursue business careers prefer to have children after they have become successful at what they do because it gives them more time to be with their kids, and they will probably benefit from that.

There is a man for the other half of the job to be done. Man was also created for a reason. Man was created to do the job of hunting and physical work. Women on the other hand was created to do the nurturing and caring. Does this mean all women have to be locked up in house nurturing their children? No. But it does mean that they should posses the qualities that is different from man. After all, wouldn't the world be boring if both man and woman possessed same qualities and there was no distinction between the two?

 

[Devious]

There is a man for the other half of the job to be done. Man was also created for a reason. Man was created to do the job of hunting and physical work. Women on the other hand was created to do the nurturing and caring. Does this mean all women have to be locked up in house nurturing their children? No. But it does mean that they should posses the qualities that is different from man. After all, wouldn't the world be boring if both man and woman possessed same qualities and there was no distinction between the two?

very true, but wouldn't women be boring if they were all the same as well. just because a woman isn't as kind and nurturing as other women, it doesn't mean she's acting like a man, as you have implied. personally i like a spunky girl, with an outgoing, fun, flirty personality who likes to go out and have fun, and has goals for her life, rather than a boring old woman who only wants to get married and raise a family and has no other aspirations for herself than that.

i understand the thinking that men are hunters and women are nurturers and caregivers, but i don't think we should expect that every woman is going to follow that idea, just as not all men would fit into the definition of what a man is supposed to be (i know i sure don't)

 

[S O F I]

and i don't particularly agree with your sentiment that women lose some of that nurturing and caring part of them if they wait until they are older to have children. in fact most women who pursue business careers prefer to have children after they have become successful at what they do because it gives them more time to be with their kids, and they will probably benefit from that.

When I said that, I meant that during this period of non-pregnancy where the women are pursuing business careers, they are stressed out due to the nature of their work and the corporate world makes a woman very sturdy, for a lack of a better word. Women who have kids in their 20s before their careers are established are much less likely to have a chance to be independent of their man and financially successful, but there's a certain feeling of love and nurture that they attain during this period with their children that women who do not conceive children don't attain. If that makes sense.

 

[Bachaveli]

as a human being you should have respect for all others unless they show disrespect to you. what does it matter if there are women like that? no one says you have to be with them. and not all women who aren't homemakers are loudmouth dominant bitches like you seem to think. to be honest, it seems to me that you want the kind of woman who will let you control and dominate her, the docile kind that wouldn't say boo to Casper the ghost. in fact, you sound like the type of guy who NEEDS to be in control of his woman. as far as i'm concerned that's not cool. a relationship should be an equal partnership between 2 people and not one controlling the other.

Well, okay maybe yea, I didn't literally mean I don't respect them but something like that. It does matter though that they are women like that. It matters and bothers a lot of course. Thats like saying what matters to you if your co-worker is a stinky who always comes to work smelling like shit. Shes only there right? not affecting you directly. But it does bother you because you see her everyday, somehow she is part of your life maybe not directly but indirectly. You wouldn't want to be working with stinky co-worker. No I'm not that type of person that you make me out to be. But at the same time I won't let a woman run over me thats for sure. And I see men as cowards who let the women control them and run over them in relationships. Unless the men is really at fault. And thats what I see these days.

 

[Devious]

When I said that, I meant that during this period of non-pregnancy where the women are pursuing business careers, they are stressed out due to the nature of their work and the corporate world makes a woman very sturdy, for a lack of a better word. Women who have kids in their 20s before their careers are established are much less likely to have a chance to be independent of their man and financially successful, but there's a certain feeling of love and nurture that they attain during this period with their children that women who do not conceive children don't attain. If that makes sense.

actually it makes a lot of sense, i do hear what you're saying and i can agree with your sentiment that the business can toughen a woman's personality. but i know women (mostly friends of the family) who waited until they were older to have children, and put their careers first, and they still managed to become great mothers. i know you weren't trying to say that this can't happen, but i just wanted to illustrate that it can. if that makes any sense either lol. i think you can see what i'm trying to say. but for the most part, i'm in agreement with you.

 

[Devious]

Well, okay maybe yea, I didn't literally mean I don't respect them but something like that. It does matter though that they are women like that. It matters and bothers a lot of course. Thats like saying what matters to you if your co-worker is a stinky who always comes to work smelling like shit. Shes only there right? not affecting you directly. But it does bother you because you see her everyday, somehow she is part of your life maybe not directly but indirectly. You wouldn't want to be working with stinky co-worker. No I'm not that type of person that you make me out to be. But at the same time I won't let a woman run over me thats for sure. And I see men as cowards who let the women control them and run over them in relationships. Unless the men is really at fault. And thats what I see these days.

well your example doesn't work really well, because short of quitting your job, there's not much you can do about a smelly co-worker (other than telling them to start wearing some damn deodorant lol). on the other hand, no one says you have to date any of these women that are like this, you have the choice to avoid those types completely if you want. and if you are just mad that these women are out there, then i only have to say one thing: suck it up. that's life. you can't go around being mad about shit like this that you can't do anything about, unless you just want to be pissed off for the rest of your life.

here's a piece of advice my Mom used to always tell me, and i don't always follow it myself, but i do my best: don't sweat the small stuff.

 

[keco52]

I think a lot women act like this...loud mouthed, fighting etc...bc they HAD to. I know a lot of ppl that grew up without a father. So the mothers were forced to be a mom and dad. They had to be stronger. I'm not saying this is always the case. If a wife or girlfriend is acting like a mans mother it's probably because he's acting like a child.
So it's not that women woke up one day and decided to act wild...men played their part also.

 

[Bachaveli]

very true, but wouldn't women be boring if they were all the same as well. just because a woman isn't as kind and nurturing as other women, it doesn't mean she's acting like a man, as you have implied. personally i like a spunky girl, with an outgoing, fun, flirty personality who likes to go out and have fun, and has goals for her life, rather than a boring old woman who only wants to get married and raise a family and has no other aspirations for herself than that.

i understand the thinking that men are hunters and women are nurturers and caregivers, but i don't think we should expect that every woman is going to follow that idea, just as not all men would fit into the definition of what a man is supposed to be (i know i sure don't)

No I didn't say women with traditional values were all boring old woman who only want to get married and raise a family. But at the same time I didn't say those same women should be wastes, sex object that spend most of the time outside than in. There is a big difference between spunky, outgoing and fun woman and loud talking, too much outgoing if that makes senses and too much flirty.

No it wouldn't be boring. Why would it be boring. See you trying to divide into categories and have different women for different reasons or something. Why? Why you feel the need to have different women - who are true women like and women that are sluty and treated as sex objects.

 

[Devious]

No I didn't say women with traditional values were all boring old woman who only want to get married and raise a family. But at the same time I didn't say those same women should be wastes, sex object that spend most of the time outside than in. There is a big difference between spunky, outgoing and fun woman and loud talking, too much outgoing if that makes senses and too much flirty.

No it wouldn't be boring. Why would it be boring. See you trying to divide into categories and have different women for different reasons or something. Why? Why you feel the need to have different women - who are true women like and women that are sluty and treated as sex objects.

see, there you go again. you make the assumption that real women are the ones who are nurturing and caring, and any other women who aren't like that are sluts who are treated like sex objects. if you really believe that then you have problems my friend. my girlfriend, while she's certainly not cold, isn't one of those caring, sensitive women who's all touchy-feely, and she damn sure isn't a slut. you're talking about me trying to divide women into different categories, which i'm not doing at all, and yet you're the one who seems to think there are only 2 types of women in this world: real women (by your lousy definition of real) and sluts. if you really feel that way than i feel sorry for you because you know nothing about women.

anyway i'm done with this conversation now, i don't think we need to continue going round and round, especially when i can see you have an obvious dislike for most women.

 

[Bachaveli]

well your example doesn't work really well, because short of quitting your job, there's not much you can do about a smelly co-worker (other than telling them to start wearing some damn deodorant lol). on the other hand, no one says you have to date any of these women that are like this, you have the choice to avoid those types completely if you want. and if you are just mad that these women are out there, then i only have to say one thing: suck it up. that's life. you can't go around being mad about shit like this that you can't do anything about, unless you just want to be pissed off for the rest of your life.

here's a piece of advice my Mom used to always tell me, and i don't always follow it myself, but i do my best: don't sweat the small stuff.

No one says you have to date them yea... good logic there. The bottom line is it does matter. Whether you date them or not, they are part of the society. They affect you one way or another. And you justify this by saying its ok to have women like this in the society, it bring diversity? Having sluty wastes. lol It brings other side of the women that we are not used to seen.

 

[Bachaveli]

see, there you go again. you make the assumption that real women are the ones who are nurturing and caring, and any other women who aren't like that are sluts who are treated like sex objects. if you really believe that then you have problems my friend. my girlfriend, while she's certainly not cold, isn't one of those caring, sensitive women who's all touchy-feely, and she damn sure isn't a slut. you're talking about me trying to divide women into different categories, which i'm not doing at all, and yet you're the one who seems to think there are only 2 types of women in this world: real women (by your lousy definition of real) and sluts. if you really feel that way than i feel sorry for you because you know nothing about women.

anyway i'm done with this conversation now, i don't think we need to continue going round and round, especially when i can see you have an obvious dislike for most women.

No I'm not saying women who are not caring and nurturing are all sluts. I'm saying THERE ARE women that act like that and possess no real women qualities such as tenderness and softness. Weren't you a second ago saying something like women will be boring if they were all the same? Implying that women should not be the same.

Ok bro. Go about your business than I guess. While you prefer women that run their big loud mouth and if necessary will claw peoples eyes out and women that behave manlike or women who enjoy being treated as sex objects....

 

[Devious]

actually i prefer females that don't fit into the neat little categories people like you try to put them in, because every person (women included, even though you don't seem to think they should) has their own individual personality and don't all fall into neat little categories. i actually think it's kinda sad that there are still people like you around, who think women (and men for that fact) should be or act a certain way, but to each their own i suppose.

Ok bro. Go about your business than I guess. While you prefer women that run their big loud mouth and if necessary will claw peoples eyes out and women that behave manlike or women who enjoy being treated as sex objects....

... while you prefer mousy little women who you can control and dominate, and who want nothing more than to be barefoot and pregnant and serve you around the clock. there are still women around like this, so there is hope for you yet bach.

 

[dillaxx]

i want a chick that's strong but still feminine.... she cant be all "independent woman, i dont need a man" kinda cunt femi-nazi bitch...... just someone that thinks on her own... but isnt gonna get all arrogant about something she might know more about..

def. something i think about now is how there are no girls out there that are good looking that dont do stupid shit, that include drinking (underage of course)... the girls that are sluts, drink, smoke, etc. sure they're good to "get lucky" with, but for something serious, you want the exact opposite while her still being good looking.. these days it's so hard to find a girl like that... even the girls that look prude, you find out they go drinking on the weekends... you see em at parties and your heart kinda sinks cuz you thought otherwise of her...

it's hypocritical cuz i do the same thing they do, smoke, drink etc.... but i dont want that, ironically, in a girl....

i dunno, maybe i'll get over it... im only a freshman in college, so im sure im bound a few more shocks before i get outta here....

 

[Bachaveli]

actually i prefer females that don't fit into the neat little categories people like you try to put them in, because every person (women included, even though you don't seem to think they should) has their own individual personality and don't all fall into neat little categories. i actually think it's kinda sad that there are still people like you around, who think women (and men for that fact) should be or act a certain way, but to each their own i suppose.

... while you prefer mousy little women who you can control and dominate, and who want nothing more than to be barefoot and pregnant and serve you around the clock. there are still women around like this, so there is hope for you yet bach.

Obviously thats not the case. But if I had to choose between the two. I would defiantly prefer to be with barefoot who would serve me around the clock versus loud mouth trash talking waste of space woman/man sex object.

 

[EDouble]

Both Inherit & Learned

 

[Bachaveli]

Nooooouuuu shit!

lol might wanna expand on that...

 

[Flipmo]

You know... I think he was just giving those as vague examples. You find me a woman who doesn't like to gossip, and I'll show you a flying pig. lol

The guy was just asking a question though, I really doubt his intention was to come in here and start a stereotyping war. I'm sure some of you are still taking your emotions from that Big E thread and brought it here.

 

[Duke]

Everything said in here about women in terms of stereotypes, desired character traits, society etc etc, applies to men as well. Kind of a stupid discussion.

And weak weak weak @ women can be slus, they shouldn't be, disrespect for their body, bladi bladi BULLSHIT. A man that gets pussy by the containerload is a player and a woman that gets cock by the shedload is a slut. Sexist bigotry, don't you love it?