Sarah Palin

PuffnScruff · Sep 6, 2008

You have to realize that when she said that, in her speech, she had been getting attacked for the previous 5 days before hand. It was her time to attack back. It was a good line. Considering the Obama camp was trying to purposely ignore the fact that she is a Gov. of a state and has done good things there. They were trying to discredit her first, so shouldn't she have some time to respond back?

Glockmatic said:

Fine tooth comb? Hardly, the elite mainstream media has barely scratched Obama's surface. The whole thing with Wright only had people questioning Obama's judgement. Nobody in the elite media has even dared to look into Obama's past and why he went by the name Barry Soetoro (sp?) and various other things. Hardly anyone asks him any real questions, like why he has flipped flopped on the issues he supported in the primaries.

The first person to suggest Obama is a muslim was a member of his own party.

The thing is, so far there has been nothing great about his past worth talking about. If you compare the two conventions, the Republican convention has many people talking about McCain and who he is. You didn't get that with the Democrats convention. His own party still really doesn't know anything about him. Even his own supporters, within his parties and regular people, can't say much about what he has done.

Devious said:

You are right it is pretty hard to believe any canidate that says they are going to unite a party. It does help if they have a proven track record.

I was saying that in a hypotechical, it may be, look at it this way sort of thing. She may have thought that her daughter was grown up enough to have sex and get knocked up that maybe she should be grown up enough to make a decision like that. Again, I;m being completely hypothetical, not saying it was a matter of fact. It just seems like a realistic thing a good parent would do. Then again most parents know their children and if that is the case she probably knew her daughter wouldn't do an abortion to begin with.

Comparing Obama's experince to Palin's experience is funny. There is a big difference. The New Yorker did a piece on Obama's past experience as a community organizer and it was not flattering at all. Neither were his days as a state Senator, especially if you look at the district he represented and the homes that were built by his friend that recently became a felon, Mr. Fat Tony.

The difference is Palin has had execuite experience, Obama has not. Obama had the luxury to say "Yes", "No", and "Present" (which seemed to be his favorite word in the state Senate). You can't do that as a Mayor or Governor. The forum that McCain and Obama attended at that recently should have been a telling look into the future of an Obama presidency. The man can't make decision and when he does they are completely for political reasons to only furthur his career. The man sings in one note. Can a man with no expirence making hard decision be trusted to run a country? A man who only seems to really care about himself?

Of course the pick of Palin was a tactical move. So was the pick of Biden. Picking Biden does nothing but try to shut up the people that say he has no forgein policy experience. Of course Biden does nothing for him in the polls and makes Obama look week for picking a person that is not only on the record for saying Obama shouldn't be president but also goes against the whole theme of the Obama campaign.

The Palin pick was also unexpected. Nobody really thought it would happen. It was also a rope-a-dope move. When it was announced nobody cared about Obama's big night and speech. They stopped talking about it. All the focus became on Palin and McCain. It worked perfectly. Not to mention that people have been saying this presidential race is going to be about skin color. Well the only person to bring up skin color in the race has been Obama. This race has been more about sexism than anything, both towards Hillary and Palin.

Regardless of how obvious it is, it worked not only to get women voters more excited from all across the board but also the conservative base that really wasn't interested in McCain. You have to understand that many conservatives weren't going to vote for McCain. Palin brought them back to him. She has appeals to independants and demcorat voters. One of my favorite blog sites is a completely pro-Hillary site and they are raving about her, despite what the MSM would have you believe. I think she will steal more of the Hillary voters than people are giving credit for.

Cooper · Sep 6, 2008

I love American politics. It makes me laugh.

I don't like her. Obama ftw.

Jeremy · Sep 6, 2008

PuffnScruff said:

A good parent would not have a 17 year old pregnant daughter. :love:

Devious · Sep 6, 2008

experience? she was a mayor of a town with 9,000 people (actually no one seems to be sure what the population in Wasilla is, is it 5,469, 9,078, or 7,025?), that hardly prepares you for leading or even co-leading a country of 300,000,000 people. as for her term as Governor, she hasn't even been there for a full term, hell she's been Governor about as long as McCain has been campaigning (joke). her lack of experience should be as much of an issue as Obama's. but it doesn't seem to be an issue to the republicans, of course not, because she's one of us.

and that brings me right back to the first sentence of my first post. republicans as well as democrats are completely blind to their own hypocrisies, they are quick to point a finger at the other guys, when they have the same issues in their own party. until these guys learn to accept each other's differences and ideologies and put them aside to work objectively together, which i don't see happening any time soon, it's just gonna be the same shit over and over and nothing real will ever get done because they are too busy nitpicking at each other. man, sometimes i really, REALLY fuckin' hate politics.

Devious · Sep 6, 2008

i found this an interesting read:

Mayor Palin: A Rough Record
Tuesday, Sep. 02, 2008 By NATHAN THORNBURGH / WASILLA, ALASKA

John McCain was clear about why he picked half-term Alaska governor Sarah Palin to be his running mate. "I found someone with an outstanding reputation for standing up to special interests and entrenched bureaucracies," he said in introducing her in Dayton, Ohio, on Friday. Palin was someone, he noted, "who reached across the aisle and asked Republicans, Democrats and independents to serve in government."

It is a powerful reinforcement of McCain's own political brand: tough, reform-minded, willing to break with his own party for the right cause. And it's true that her high-profile crusade against corruption and complacency in her own state party over the past few years has made Palin the Frank Serpico of Alaska politics: she publicly ratted out her state party chairman; whupped the good old boys' network, as she likes to put it, in a gubernatorial primary; and fought a general election in which the scandal-stained state GOP didn't lift a finger on her behalf. She won only because she had the enthusiastic backing of independents and grass-roots activists.

But in the first major race of her career — the 1996 campaign for mayor of her hometown, Wasilla — Palin was a far more conventional politician. In fact, according to some who were involved in that fight, Palin was a highly polarizing political figure who brought partisan politics and hot-button social issues like abortion and gun control into a mayoral race that had traditionally been contested like a friendly intramural contest among neighbors.

In the early '90s, Wasilla was little more than half as big as it is today, and much more loosely confederated. The main issue then, says longtime resident Chas St. George, was public safety. "We needed a police department," he says. "So we set up a group to make it happen." That group — Watch on Wasilla — included a handful of the town's most influential figures: St. George; the town's mayor, John Stein; and Palin, who wasn't in elected office yet. Her father-in-law Jim Palin and his wife Faye were also in the group.

Eventually, they started a police department, led by chief Irl Stambaugh. Kaylene Johnson, author of Sarah, a Palin biography published earlier this year, says one place where the power group met was a step-aerobics class that Stambaugh and Stein took along with Palin. That class signed the original petition for Palin's first political race, for city council in 1992, which she won.

Four years later, she took on her former workout buddy in a race that quickly became contentious. In Stein's view, Palin's main transgression was injecting big-time politics into a small-town local race. "It was always a nonpartisan job," he says. "But with her, the state GOP came in and started affecting the race." While Palin often describes that race as having been a fight against the old boys' club, Stein says she made sure the campaign hinged on issues like gun owners' rights and her opposition to abortion (Stein is pro-choice). "It got to the extent that — I don't remember who it was now — but some national antiabortion outfit sent little pink cards to voters in Wasilla endorsing her," he says.

Vicki Naegele was the managing editor of the Mat-Su Valley Frontiersman at the time. "[Stein] figured he was just going to run your average, friendly small-town race," she recalls, "but it turned into something much different than that." Naegele held the same conservative Christian beliefs as Palin but didn't think they had any place in local politics.

"I just thought, That's ridiculous, she should concentrate on roads, not abortion," says Naegele.

St. George worked on Stein's campaign at the time, and while he says he has no reason to dispute Stein's recollection of events, he doesn't remember Palin's conduct being beyond the pale. "Our tax coffers were starting to grow," he says. "John was for expanding services, and Sarah wasn't. That's what the race was about."

One thing all sides agree on is that the valley was in flux. The old libertarian pioneer ethos was giving way to a rising Christian conservatism. By shrewdly invoking issues that mattered to the ascendant majority, Palin won the mayor's race. But while she may have been a new face, says Naegele, she was no maverick — not yet. "The state party gave her the mechanism to get into that office," says Naegele. "As soon as she was confident enough to brush them off, she did. But she wasn't an outsider to start with. She very much had to kowtow to them."

Governing was no less contentious than campaigning, at least to begin with. Palin ended up dismissing almost all the city department heads who had been loyal to Stein, including a few who had been instrumental in getting her into politics to begin with. Some saw it as a betrayal. Stambaugh, the police chief and a member of Palin's step-aerobics class, filed a lawsuit for wrongful termination, alleging that Palin terminated him in part at the behest of the National Rifle Association, because he had opposed a concealed-gun law that the NRA supported. He eventually lost the suit. The animosity spawned some talk of a recall attempt, but eventually Palin's opponents in the city council opted for a more conciliatory route.

At some point in those fractious first days, Palin told the department heads they needed her permission to talk to reporters. "She put a gag order on those people, something that you'd expect to find in the big city, not here," says Naegele. "She flew in there like a big-city gal, which she's not. It was a strange time, and [the Frontiersman] came out very harshly against her."

[PS: here is the thing about her wanting to censor books]

Stein says that as mayor, Palin continued to inject religious beliefs into her policy at times. "She asked the library how she could go about banning books," he says, because some voters thought they had inappropriate language in them. "The librarian was aghast." That woman, Mary Ellen Baker, couldn't be reached for comment, but news reports from the time show that Palin had threatened to fire Baker for not giving "full support" to the mayor.

St. George, however, points out that Palin couldn't have seen everything through an Evangelical lens. She did, he says, notably resist calls to restrict operating hours for the bars in town. And even if faith did play an unusually large role in her decision-making as mayor, it may have only reflected the continued rise of Evangelicalism in the valley, a growth that continues to this day.

"We like to call this the Bible Belt of Alaska," says Cheryl Metiva, head of the local chamber of commerce. Churches proliferate in Wasilla today, and among the largest and most influential is the Wasilla Bible Church, where the Palins worship.

At the 11:15 a.m. Sunday service, hundreds sit in folding chairs, listening to a 20-minute sermon about the Book of Malachi and singing along to alt-rock praise songs. The only sign of culture warring in the whole production is an insert in the day's program advertising an upcoming Focus on the Family conference on homosexuality in Anchorage called Love Won Out. The group promises to teach attendees how to "respond to misinformation in our culture" and help them "overcome" homosexuality.

When Palin, who went on to win re-election by a landslide, was forced out of the Mayor's office by term limits in 2002, her husband Todd's stepmother Faye Palin ran for mayor. She did not, however, get Sarah Palin's endorsement. A couple of people told me that they thought abortion was the reason for Palin not supporting her family member — Faye, they say, is pro-choice, not to mention a Democrat. A former city council member recalls that it was a heated race, mainly because of right-to-life issues: "People were writing BABYKILLER on Faye's campaign signs just a few days before the election." Faye Palin lost the race to the candidate that Sarah backed, Dianne Keller, who is still mayor of Wasilla. (Over the weekend, Faye Palin told the New York Daily News that she liked listening to Barack Obama speak and that she wasn't sure who she would vote for in November.)

By the time Sarah Palin was entering state politics, the hottest issue in Alaska wasn't gay marriage or even abortion. It was corruption and cronyism. Andrew Halcro, a noted Palin critic who ran against her as an independent in the governor's race, says she knew instinctively that the issues were changing. Plus, he says, her opponents, such as incumbent governor Frank Murkowski, whom she defeated in the primary, were just as hard-right on abortion and guns as she was.

She needed a new political identity to make it to the next level, so ethics reform became her calling card. "She's a very savvy politician," says Halcro. "So wedge issues were not part of the portfolio."

"If anything," he says, "she got tired of answering questions about them." Halcro recalls one debate in October 2006 in which, after repeated questions about her opposition to abortion even in cases of rape or incest, she looked at the moderator with exasperation and asked if they were going to talk about anything besides abortion. It was detracting from her new message: cleaning up the capitol.

Nor has Palin made social issues the cornerstone of her governorship. When a parental consent law was struck down by Alaska's highest court in 2007, Palin called the decision "outrageous" but refused calls from conservatives to remedy the defeat by introducing antiabortion legislation in a session that was supposed to be about drilling rights.

Wearing her faith quietly fits more with Palin's personality, says St. George. "In all the years I've known Sarah and her parents, we never talked about right-to-life or any of that," he says. "She doesn't let those issues get in the way of getting things done for the community."

In the end, her political journey from banner-waving GOP social conservative to maverick reformer may simply be about good timing. It's what former journalist Bill McAllister, who now works for Palin's press staff, used to call "Sarah-dipity" — that uncanny gift of knowing exactly what voters are looking for at a particular moment. And, of course, the political will to give them what they want.

Mayor Palin: A Rough Record - TIME

Glockmatic · Sep 6, 2008

PuffnScruff said:

Would a doctor who said that doctors are like nurses except they actually save lives go well with a crowd? Of course she was "attacked" for five days, she's a governor with two years experience in governing and most of America had no idea who she was. Obama may not has "executive" experience but if the democrats didn't like that they wouldn't have nominated him and thats the main issue with Palin, she's a person with little experience and was chosen by one person compared to 18 million by Obama.

I don't know what you're watching but I've been seeing a lot of shows detailing Obama's past as well as McCain's.

Obama flip flopping? Did you know McCain's stances in 2000 compared to 2008? They're complete opposites. He's no longer a maverick, he went against his values to be elected.

I've heard of Barack being called Barry before (we all had nicknames in highschool and college) but never heard of the last name thing so I can't really comment on that part.

And who keeps it up?

Edit: Researching it more, it looks like that the group Vietnam Vets Against John Kerry guys spread the rumours of Barack being a muslim. The thing you're talking about is Hillary's camp releasing the picture of Obama wearing african garments.

So I guess the line "People will be voting on personality and not issues" rings true to you?

Devious · Sep 6, 2008

well it appears she isn't very strong on drug use and putting a stop to it.

Troopers dub Mat-Su area the meth capital of Alaska
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
WASILLA - The Matanuska-Susitna area is the methamphetamine capital of Alaska, according to Alaska State Troopers.

In 2003, authorities uncovered nine meth labs in the area. Last year, the number increased to 42, said Kyle Young, an investigator with the troopers who works with the Mat-Su narcotics team.

Officials with the Office of Children's Services in Wasilla said the problem affects children. The office receives about 40 calls a month from people reporting abuse or neglect involving some aspect of the highly addictive drug.

In late February, the Mat-Su narcotics unit arrested a couple at their Willow home. Michelle Motta said for years she tried to warn authorities that her three young nieces lived in the midst of a methamphetamine operation run by their parents, Phillip Dean and Laura Jackson.

Alaska State Troopers reported finding a "large active meth lab" in a detached garage shop. The house was a frigid mess, with piles of dirty dishes, clothes everywhere and frozen pipes, investigators said.

Through a hatch in the shop floor, the team found an underground room with a meth lab in one corner, as well as old marijuana root balls and lights from a past pot-growing operation.

An investigator said the team didn't find the children at home but saw signs of them there. Motta said the girls - ages 14, 8 and 6 - at times slept in the garage with the lab.

A year ago, the oldest girl detailed the household's rampant drug problems and squalid living conditions in a handwritten letter to a judge.

"My parents grow marijuana and crystal the(y) did the drugs that they bought in front of (my sisters)," the letter begins. "They spent most money on them instead of food or doing laundry. I got left home with nobody there I got left home with drug(g)ies..."

Motta now has custody of her three nieces. The Jacksons are jailed at Mat-Su Pre-Trial Facility in Palmer.

Children sharing homes with meth labs face the risk of contamination, fire, explosion, neglect and hazardous living conditions. Caseworkers report little children complaining of breathing problems from toxic fumes rising off chemicals such as acetone, ammonia and hydrochloric acid.

When authorities surrounded a converted bus housing a meth operation in Big Lake in January, a 13-year-old boy who answered the door bragged that his mom cooked the best meth in the valley, according to the troopers.

During a 2003 bust at a house outside Wasilla, officers discovered five children living inside, all younger than 8 years old.

The calls about meth to children's services in Wasilla accounts for as many as 40 percent of the agency's total monthly child protection calls.

The troopers are aggressively going after meth labs, said Capt. Ed Harrington, the supervisor of the state's drug and alcohol enforcement unit.

"It's just not a simple process," Harrington said. "Just because somebody calls in and says 'So and so's cooking meth' doesn't mean we're going to kick the door in the next night."

Juneau Empire Story Archive

so how much time and effort has she put in to stopping this? almost none it seems, even though her own hometown is considered the Meth capital of the state, she didn't seem too interested in dealing with the problem.

S O F I · Sep 6, 2008

Does it really matter? You guys are wasting time arguing. Obama is winning the presidency and in less than 6 months, she'll be off the map. The only good thing about Sarah Palin is my facebook status update, which reads "Fact: Palin's daughter is a whore".

Glockmatic · Sep 6, 2008

I find it quite enjoyable arguing over politics, I'm sure others find it the same as well

Snowman · Sep 7, 2008

Glockmatic you dont have a clue do you. you need to re-read what Puff said.

Sarah Palin is by far a way better candidate that Obama and Biden. *you democrats are gonna be heart broken when Obama loses in Nov*.

her daughters pregnant at 17. Yes she's gonna marry the guy who knocked her up. thats a true christian woman for you. Any of Obama's nieces were 17 and pregnant they wouldnt marry the man that knocked them up.

im glad McCain and Palin want to do drilling in Alaska, we need to do that. so we dont have to depend on the towel heads in the middle east and Chavez dumb ass in S. America.

and Creation in schools YES we need that more than anything. at one time Glockmatic many many moons ago you had a moment in Public schools where you stood up and repeated a thing called the pledge of allegence. where everybody in the US public school said *one nation under GOD*.

i expect you not to understand it cause it was way before your time. I happen to be a part of that era when God was in public schools. you had no school shootings, you had no problems with students beating up teachers, you never had cases where teachers were having sex with students.

you had fights, you had the occasional women getting pregnant. back in your parents time.. students respected the teachers. dont believe me ask them. back then you go to school and you never even seen metal detectors, (Why are there metal detectors in the schools today)??

heres where things went downhill.. kids were going to school reciting the pledge of alliegence, they were coming home.. Parents would ask them *how was your day at school*?? kids would say fine we recited the pledge before the start of the school day.

Mom and Dad become Irrate *WHAT* there pushing god on you?? well we cant have that we dont believe in christianity were atheists. were gonna complain and protest about it til something gets done. and thru the course of time the US government bans god in public schools. and our government brainwashes everybody (Even i had to sit thru it) with the BS of Evolution.

so evolution in public schools became the downfall of how bad schools are in the US today, that and parents having kids and letting society raise them.

let me throw this out as an example... lets say parents and kids in a public school believe in god 98% of them. and 2 % of the kids and parents dont believe in god. what happened thru the course of time our Government didnt listen to the 98%. they listen to the few atheists and got God banned out of the public school. (you would think they'd listen to the majority). NO. and thats why schools are the way they are in America.

I hope Palin and McCain are successful with a turnaround. would you see Obama pushing for Creation being taught in Public Schools.. NOOOOO he cant even swear on a stack of bibles.

and back to the topic of the thread Gov Palin is gorgeous for a 44 yr old. Like Letterman said she looks like a Lenscrafters model. Lol. (she's only 14 yrs older than me)

Cooper · Sep 7, 2008

Creationism should NOT be taught in schools. (Evolution isn't BS btw, God is)

Illuminattile · Sep 7, 2008

Snowman said:

:lol:

So school shootings, teenage pregnancy and violence in schools is all because kids don't have to pledge allegiance to a god that a lot of kids don't believe in? Or is evolution 50% responsible?

Chronic · Sep 7, 2008

Snowman your post was fulled with nothing but Christian extremist views. A little less violent than your Muslim counterparts but you're travelling in the same boat. Do you believe the US soldiers in Iraq are losing because back home the US has been turned into Sodom and Gommorah as well?

"Unmarried 17 year old girl gets pregnant and decided to marry to father"

Yeah, regular poster child for a "true Christian".

I don't think Puff agrees with you at all. I think he's more along the lines of playing devil's advocate, which is always valid in politics. You're more along the lines of a Christian that in no way resembles Christ.

You can believe in evolution and still believe in God. And if you want to talk about brainwashing then lets talk about Bible Camps for kids. Creating a nation of God-fearing hatemongers.

I'm with Jeremy on this one. I don't follow politics but I look at their personality. Obama and McCain are both against same-sex marriage but the difference is that Obama wants gay people to have the same rights (ie get married in the legal sense). Point here is trying to take a look at how these politicians will treat people who don't follow their lifestyle. I'm sure McCain and Sarah Palin are good to the people they consider to be "American" but what happens when you no longer fit their description of an American? And I think with a country as divided as the US that's a real problem.

raywaters11 · Sep 7, 2008

i believe... a kid can get pregnant even if they have good parenting. parents arent there 100% of the time, kids are curious, and she is doing the responsible thing. she's 17, could be 18 before the kid is born, and its not like she's knocked up by her mom, so why should it go against palin?

i think drilling in alaska is a great idea. whatever takes down the gas prices im all for. nuke the bald eagles for all i care if it'll get gas under 2 bucks.

palin is hot. i'd bang her. end of story.

with all this said, i would still go for obama. im not voting for a president based on their vice presidents and the vp's pasts. eight years ago, i would have prolly went for mccain, but he turned into george w's little puppet and completely went with all his ideas, and what we do NOT need, is another george bush.

i wish hillary had won. or at least been obama's vp.

raywaters11 · Sep 7, 2008

she hunts, she was a beauty queen, basketball star in her town... bitch keeps gettin hotter.

Prize Gotti · Sep 7, 2008

Sarah Palin is a Milf, has to be the sexiest women I've ever seen in a government through out the world.

raywaters11 · Sep 7, 2008

exactly

Glockmatic · Sep 7, 2008

Snowman said:

Well we'll see in November.

Why wouldn't they? Because they're black?

America has 5% of the world's oil but uses 25% of the world's oil. It's ridiculous to think that drilling in Alaska will lower gas prices since drilling doesn't happen instantly, they still need to build the facilities and pipelines to refineries. (Nice to see you added some racism there)

There's a study showing that the majority of people in prison are religious, taking out god in schools affect nothing. Read up on evolution and learn something

The government is governing what is in the constitution. They're upholding the rights of the people which both parties are saying they would do.

raywaters11 · Sep 7, 2008

p.s. i do think creationism should be taught in schools.

Euphanasia · Sep 7, 2008

PuffnScruff said:

Actually, the Fox news reference was not a joke. It seemed to me that you believed the statistics that Palin had more viewers than Obama and since that is indeed false, I assumed you got the information from a biased news station. That's merely logic.

PuffnScruff said:

Yes, that is bad. Why have a balance that involves teaching something credible and something made up? If people want to teach such things as creationism for what they are - intriguing stories - then so be it. But let's not teach some obvious fairytale as actual fact.

Snowman said:

Um you're drawing a parallel between two completely unrelated things. The fact that a class of students saying "under God" while reciting the pledge of allegiance in between yawns in their homerooms at 7 or 8 am has absolutely nothing to do with the increase in violence in today's schools. That's just plain stupid.

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