Why the world hates America right now.

[Duke]

First things first, this is not an America-bashing thread, I just want to point something out.

For us foreigners (not US residents), the face of your country is your president, your government, the things they say and do.

Now we have this Georgia - Russia crisis.

Has anyone else besides me watched, with growing bewilderment, how president Bush strongly condemnded "the invading of sovereign nations"?


I mean, SERIOUSLY! How many pounds of butter does this man have on his head? Is there no one in the Bush administration that went "uuuh, actually, sir..."

Really....how can you get those words out of your mouth without immediately falling into a hellish pit of embarassment and guilt?


And that's why we all dislike America right now. Your president thinks you lot can and will get away with anything, you see? Is it a surprise this breeds poor sentiment amongst the rest of the 5.7 billion people on this world?


And it doesn't mean we actually hate the PEOPLE of the United States...but a great many of you did vote for this man...

 

[Preach]

I sincerely concur. There will be people who point out the complexity of the Georgia situation and debate this, but the fact of the matter is, the US should intervene but don't dare. They like to pose as the white knight but they're the first to run at the sign of a real confrontation. Like a school bully.

In the end I'm happy because when the US/Russia nuclear war starts I'm sorta fucked. But principally, it pisses me the hell off too.

 

[Duke]

Well, whether they should intervene or not doesn't matter. It's Bush ("The Americans") condemning one nation's actions when in fact they do almost the exact same thing themselves.


So it's ok for the US to invade Afghanistan, Iraq and all the Grenada's of this world, but when Russia has a dispute with their neighbour (and not a country actually 4000 miles away) over a simmering conflict that's been brewing for years, now all of a sudden Russia is wrong, immoral and unethical?

That went down the very very VERY wrong way with the rest of the world here.

 

[PuffnScruff]

I understand what you are saying and also found myself laughing a bit when Bush would say those things to the world but you are forgetting and ignoring a few important things. Russia didn't go before the U.N. before going into Georgia. Georgia wasn't in violation of over a dozen sanctions. The U.S. did and Iraq was. I think that is a very important distinction when comparing the actions of the U.S. and Russia.

Your statement about people voting for Bush I think shows what your intentions of this thread is. It is not to debate an issue but to shit and bash on Bush/U.S./the yanks/Americans. You don't seem to fully understand everything that lead up to the situation in Iraq. It was going to happen even if Bush lost the eleciton in 2000. Go search out the statements from just a few years before the Iraq war, even from before the 2000 election. Every major Democrat that is against the war now was for it in the late 90's and up until 2003. Their statements our public record and hell you can find youtube videos of them saying this stuff. People didn't vote for Bush because they thought "hey this man wants a war! FUCK YEA!" Get real.

 

[Jokerman]

I'm surprised anyone is still expecting to hear anything sane and reasonable coming from Bush & Co. They have an agenda to perpetuate tensions. Europe should just ignore the US and set their own terms with Russia to resolve this situation.

 

[Elmira]

That is the problem with leading world power nations like the U.S., they are forced to assert themselves in every conflict, stretch themselves too thin in order to stay in power. When you're on top, you could care less about likability factor.


Since the break-up of the Soviet Union, U.S. foreign policy has been one aimed at curtailing Russia's influence and still-standing cold war policies in former Soviet states. So the U.S. involvement in the Russia-Georgia conflict should come as no surprise. Such involvement is more about restricting Russian control than just sticking your nose where it doesn't belong. Because I don't think a super-power like the U.S. feels there is any place on the Earth that it has not been mandated a divine right not to stick their nose into.

Foreign policy is what foreign policy is I suppose, but our involvement in the conflict can only turn the ordeal into a fiasco. And what one nation sees as backward thinking policies may not be so backward for a nation that is not as progressive as the other.

 

[S O F I]

Since the break-up of the Soviet Union, US foreign policy has been rebuilding Russia's economy (90s shock therapy) and transforming it into a liberal democracy; the ultimate goal with Russia being present-day Georgia. That is, a country with democratic reforms with a foreign policy of being America's puppet.

and then there was Putin. And increasing oil prices. And increasing nationalization of Russia's biggest companies and oil reserves.

The problem with Jokerman's statement is that when he says "The EU should set its own terms with Russia", that really means "Russia will set its own terms with the EU and the EU will abide". That's what will happen if the US were to stand back. Hell, that's what will happen if the US does not stand back, it just might be a bumpy ride that's all.

Russia doesn't want diplomacy and it does not want stable relations with the West unless the stable relations are directly in Russia's favor. Russia wants hegemony.

I digressed a bit. Anyway, I agree with what Puff had to say; there are distinct differences between what Russia did and what America did.


and did I say I'm extremely excited about international politics for years to come?

 

[Bender]

I love Bush!

 

[bacho2]

That is, a country with democratic reforms with a foreign policy of being America's puppet.

When you have a small, tiny country like Georgia whose population is just under 5 million, and going against a country that is twenty times bigger and the military power thats one of the strongest in the world, it must pick a side because it can not hold the ground on its own with that small men power.

Georgia had two options: The “crazy ivan” who has throughout the history been on Georgia’s tail and Georgia can't seem to avoid their constant aggression, or the Uncle Sam who at least has democracy and runs the type of gov't compare to Russia, that values more freedom.

Georgia chose the side that values its freedom and rightly so. I don't want to be living in a society where I have people telling me what to do and how to go about my business, what to produce, sell, how much of it and how. I don't want to live in a society where I might be pulled over and being arrested just for being Georgian. I don't want to live in a society where I fear of getting killed just to voice my opinion about my dislikes of the government or the corruption of the government (see Anna Politkovskaya’s death). I’m not necessarily saying these things doesn’t happen in US, but compare to Russia, its no contest.

So, you can look at as Georgia being US's puppet but just about any tiny country like Georgia, in time of war, picks a side. It must do this or else they will be run over.

Europe should just ignore the US and set their own terms with Russia to resolve this situation.

If you are insisting that UN should step in and do something to stop Russia than you are saying something that might take ages to happen. The UN can not do shit to stop Russia in this conflict.

 

[Kong]

EVERYBODY WANNA BE AN AMERICAN BUT DONT NOBODY WANNA BE AN AMERICAN.

A country is the people not the government. How can you take a government as the face of a country in this day and age?

 

[S. Fourteen]

A country is the people not the government. How can you take a government as the face of a country in this day and age?

When a black man is elected? heh

 

[lii]

because our governments have gone crazy with power
and we're all pawns at their disposal