US Prison System "Costly Failure"?

[S O F I]

US prison system 'costly failure'

The US prison population has risen eight-fold since 1970, with little impact on crime but at great cost to the taxpayer, researchers say.

There are more than 1.5 million people in US state and federal jails, a report by a Washington-based criminal justice research group, the JFA Institute says.

Inmate numbers are projected to rise by 192,000 in five years, costing $27.5bn (£13.44bn) to build and run jails.

The JFA recommends reducing the number and length of sentences.

The Unlocking America report, which was published on Monday, also advocated changing terms of parole and finding alternatives to prison as part of a major overhaul of the US justice system.

"There is no evidence that keeping people in prison longer makes us any safer," said JFA president James Austin.

Women convicts

The report said that US crime rates, which have been in decline since the 1990s, are about the same as those for 1973.

It says the incarceration rate has soared because sentences have got longer and those who violate parole or probation are more likely to be given prison terms.

The report said that every year hundreds of thousands of Americans are sent to jail "for crimes that pose little if any danger or harm to society".

It cited several examples including a Florida woman's two-year sentence for throwing a cup of coffee at another car in a traffic row.

Its recommendations run counter to the Bush administration's policy of longer, harsher sentences, which the government says has contributed to falling violent crime and murder figures.

The JFA researchers found that women represented the fastest-growing sector of the US prison population.

The report was funded by the Rosenbaum Foundation and the Open Society Institute.
Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/americas/7102054.stm

What's the root of the problem?

 

[PuffnScruff]

well if you had read the article it is obvious, "the bush administration's policy of longer, harsher sentences,..."

i don't think you can pin it on one "root" problem. if it were that simple you could say it was because these people are evil to the core and will never find the path to that leads toward jesus.

there are many reasons that probably contribute to this. i'll try to explain what i mean when i'm not half asleep.

 

[S O F I]

I read the article, but Bush' explanation obviously does not shed light on the root of the problem. The question I posed was more or less just to fulfill the character requirement to create a new thread, but I'd be willing to argue that it's a good question, if you choose to go down that...very dark path.

 

[hizzle?]

Send them to Australia, again.

 

[Euphanasia]

Prison is not an effective deterrent to crime and neither is capital punishment. We have a long way to go in finding and executing alternative means of punishment that is actually effective.

 

[Sebastian]

Just kill them all.

 

[AmerikazMost]

1. Take politics out of the judicial system.

2. Reform penalties to hit small-time offenders in their pockets instead of imprisoning them.

3. Invest money into rebuilding and supporting the infrastructure of poor areas.

4. Build more prisons.

 

[Preach]

the problem is one country with too many people in it.

 

[Euphanasia]

1. Take politics out of the judicial system.

2. Reform penalties to hit small-time offenders in their pockets instead of imprisoning them.

3. Invest money into rebuilding and supporting the infrastructure of poor areas.

4. Build more prisons.

I agree with the first three points but could not disagree more with the fourth - building more prisons is the exact opposite of what needs to be done. Building more prisons does not help solve the problem, it perpetuates it. We need less prisons. We need something in place that actually works.

 

[AmerikazMost]

I agree with the first three points but could not disagree more with the fourth - building more prisons is the exact opposite of what needs to be done. Building more prisons does not help solve the problem, it perpetuates it. We need less prisons. We need something in place that actually works.

Are you implying that building more prisons will induce a greater demand to imprisoned in one? All but an extremely small percentage of criminals commit those crimes for the purpose of going to prison.

Building more prisons simply reduces the strain on the current ones, which are filled beyond capacity. It's uncomfortable for both the the personnel and the inmates who are forced to sleep on mattresses in the hallways.

 

[Duke]

The root of the problem is that the US, as the world's richest country, still has like 30 million people living below the poverty line.

 

[AmerikazMost]

The root of the problem is that the US, as the world's richest country, still has like 30 million people living below the poverty line.

Yep. Some of the best ways to fight crime are through education and economic equality, two things we severely struggle with.

 

[Duke]

Yep. Some of the best ways to fight crime are through education and economic equality, two things we severely struggle with.

Aye. I'd be dealing drugs as well if I had children to support and the only one who will give me an actual job is a seedy fast food joint that underpays you enough to barely support yourself. Let alone a family.

 

[Shahin]

At the risk of sounding like a bleeding heart I think safer, more humane prisons is one of the key issues that need to be adressed. I know people get mad when they hear people say that because prison is meant to be punishment but really, the fact that prisons are so fucked up is one of the biggest reasons they're overcrowded right now. If you get five years in prison you need to completely change your mentality to make it and once you get back out you're likely to continue living like that.

 

[Duke]

^^ That is true. But on the other hand, we have to admit that some of the criminals are simply "inrehabitable" (is that a word?). You get my point, some of those guys are so whacked out there's no way they'll ever be an honest citizen.

So how do you seperate the ones with chances from the ones that can't be "saved"?

 

[Euphanasia]

Are you implying that building more prisons will induce a greater demand to imprisoned in one? All but an extremely small percentage of criminals commit those crimes for the purpose of going to prison.

Building more prisons simply reduces the strain on the current ones, which are filled beyond capacity. It's uncomfortable for both the the personnel and the inmates who are forced to sleep on mattresses in the hallways.

What I'm saying is that the prison system is clearly not working and building it up further is not going to fix it. You don't put more time and money into something that is ineffective.

 

[AmerikazMost]

What I'm saying is that the prison system is clearly not working and building it up further is not going to fix it. You don't put more time and money into something that is ineffective.

Obviously you make other improvements as well. I wasn't implying that each one of those four proposals were solutions in and of themselves. By acting upon all of them can you help fix the problems.

 

[Shahin]

^^ That is true. But on the other hand, we have to admit that some of the criminals are simply "inrehabitable" (is that a word?). You get my point, some of those guys are so whacked out there's no way they'll ever be an honest citizen.

So how do you seperate the ones with chances from the ones that can't be "saved"?

Why would you need to separate them? I'm not saying punishments shouldn't be severe for crimes such as murder, rape etc. If someone is inrehabitable (I don't know if that's an actual word either) then I'm sure that will show from their crimes and they'll spend the majority of their lives behind bars anyway. But those who are possible to rehabilitate should have a chance to live as humans rather than animals while locked up.

 

[AmerikazMost]

Why would you need to separate them? I'm not saying punishments shouldn't be severe for crimes such as murder, rape etc. If someone is inrehabitable (I don't know if that's an actual word either) then I'm sure that will show from their crimes and they'll spend the majority of their lives behind bars anyway. But those who are possible to rehabilitate should have a chance to live as humans rather than animals while locked up.

Prisons weren't created to rehabilitate people. Really, it's simple economics.

Just like in the economy, in the legal realm there are behaviors you want to encourage and behaviors you do not want to encourage. Economically, you want to encourage free trade to increase competitiveness, so you eliminate tariffs. You don't want corporate shareholders to save all of their profits, so you give them tax breaks when they invest money into improving production.

Legally, you don't want people to behave outside of the law. In order to deter them from doing so, you create costs (punishments) that are large enough to make them wary of doing so. Prison, taking time from your life and removing the freedom to live within your desired conditions, is that cost. If we make prison life too "humane" and like everyday life for law-abiding citizens, it removes the deterrence factor.

That's why people living in poor conditions are more likely to commit crimes--they have less to lose by going to prison than someone with a nice house in an upscale neighborhood.

 

[Shahin]

Prisons weren't created to rehabilitate people. Really, it's simple economics.

Just like in the economy, in the legal realm there are behaviors you want to encourage and behaviors you do not want to encourage. Economically, you want to encourage free trade to increase competitiveness, so you eliminate tariffs. You don't want corporate shareholders to save all of their profits, so you give them tax breaks when they invest money into improving production.

Legally, you don't want people to behave outside of the law. In order to deter them from doing so, you create costs (punishments) that are large enough to make them wary of doing so. Prison, taking time from your life and removing the freedom to live within your desired conditions, is that cost. If we make prison life too "humane" and like everyday life for law-abiding citizens, it removes the deterrence factor.

That's why people living in poor conditions are more likely to commit crimes--they have less to lose by going to prison than someone with a nice house in an upscale neighborhood.

Obviously I understand all this but I think the deterrant should be the severity of the punishment that the law hands out. People need to be punished in prisons but something needs to be done about the rape, beatings and murders which occur in there, and people need to be given more incentives to learn a trade so they can be useful when they get out. As it is now people just learn to behave like animals to survive and that's not benefitting anyone. Years or decades in prison is still a strong enough deterrant IMO.