Controlled Breeding

Pittsey

Knock, Knock...
Staff member
#21
So you suggets we send soldiers over there to force them to their luck?

We also could provide them with medicine for AIDS and provide food and money .... oh no, wait, that would cost US money and wealth. Plus, you'r right, that's a different kettle of fish and not .... evolution.
As there is no cure, I think prevention would be a better choice.

Charity doesn't do much. Education is required. I don't think soldiers make good teachers, although maybe a small percentage would, so let's not send them.

And Zimbabwe was in a better state when the evil white man was in charge, as the evil black man made it worse.
 

The.Menace

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#22
Of course there is no cure but still there is medicin, just too expensive for them. And yes, prevention is a nice thing, but that's for sure not done with sterilization or aboration but condoms - that has nothing to do with 'controlled breeding'. Education. Nice. Well let's build schools then. Oh, would cost money and we don't have enough.

Plus.....it's hypocrite to say it was better when they white man was in charge. Because white man came, destroyed culture and all structures, named countries and draw borders and then, they left. Leaving nothing behind but destruction. every historian will tell you that the situation we have in africa right now has nothing to do with a bad black man but is the direct consequence of the european imperialism - our past actions are the reason for those bad black man beeing in charge now, there is no question about it and it's a shame that we as western world did back out just like that, act as if we had no responsibility for the situation. It's way to simple to say, we gave them their land back, now it's their fault.... Besides that, those corruped black leaders often act in interest of our corrupt politicans and cooperations, that's clear. We don't leave africa alone, not all, it's the future battleground of china, USA and the EU. It's clear and it's all there so it's just too simple to claim it's the fault of bad black men.

Anyway. That's off topic, start a new thread if you want to discuss that.
 

Pittsey

Knock, Knock...
Staff member
#23
Of course there is no cure but still there is medicin, just too expensive for them. And yes, prevention is a nice thing, but that's for sure not done with sterilization or aboration but condoms - that has nothing to do with 'controlled breeding'. Education. Nice. Well let's build schools then. Oh, would cost money and we don't have enough.

Plus.....it's hypocrite to say it was better when they white man was in charge. Because white man came, destroyed culture and all structures, named countries and draw borders and then, they left. Leaving nothing behind but destruction. every historian will tell you that the situation we have in africa right now has nothing to do with a bad black man but is the direct consequence of the european imperialism - our past actions are the reason for those bad black man beeing in charge now, there is no question about it and it's a shame that we as western world did back out just like that, act as if we had no responsibility for the situation. It's way to simple to say, we gave them their land back, now it's their fault.... Besides that, those corruped black leaders often act in interest of our corrupt politicans and cooperations, that's clear. We don't leave africa alone, not all, it's the future battleground of china, USA and the EU. It's clear and it's all there so it's just too simple to claim it's the fault of bad black men.

Anyway. That's off topic, start a new thread if you want to discuss that.

I don't disagree that the Belgians and Dutch came and ruined the African culture. That wasn't the point I was making. I only mentioned 1 country. Zimbabwe was definitely better run as Rhodesia. It is awful now. And yes, it is the fault of past actions. But that again, is also a lack of education.... Mugabe was the people's choice.


But... I was just baiting a little.... I don't think anyone here really feels that the 1984 route is the correct route. just an answer to the world's problems... Even if it isn't the right one.... Nothing is black or white... And if the answers were easy, they'd have been put into practice already....

Africa can't blame all it's problems on the white man, or be fixed with huge amounts of money. There are underlying problems that will never be solved.... And the main problem being a lack of education... Which still isn't being righted. No matter how many charities are involved, corruption (on several continents) stops the money getting to the core of the problems.
 

The.Menace

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#24
The whole democratic process was learned and fought for in Europe for 100s of years. You can not just call an election, write a constitution and expect it to work. It doesn't. The system in africa was one of chiefs and tribes which was taken away from them and led to the fucked up situation we have right now. You are right, education is key, but it wasn't there, all this couldn't work. .....so yes, somehow it was the people's choice, somehow it's not. they are not there yet. And it doesn't work that way.... (the other question is, do we want them educated and have a strong opinion - or do 'we' enjoy the low price for blood diamonds and other resources?)

they funny thing is, even though that's known, the 'west' makes the same fault again. The US thought they could go to Afganisthan and Iraq and install democracy there. It doesn't work that way, it was clear all along (and many people said it) and 10 years later it's obvious. Learm from history, and because people don't do, history repeats itself.
 

Preach

Well-Known Member
#25
It was my fault probabaly to overestimate the average knowledge of the forum, but I expected more from you Preach than that. You don't understand evolution one bit I suppose. And no, just because you can't follow me I didn't want to say something else. don't critizes me like that because all I want to tell you at the moment is f*ck you. No, I didn't wanted to say
First of all, there is no reason to be smug or offensive. I tried my best to remain 100% objective when I wrote my post. No one part of my post was meant as a slight to you or your points. I understand evolution very well, and that's a part of the discussion you didn't explicitly state in your first post. I agree with your point. Just because people would make good parents doesn't mean they have the best or strongest genes, so this law could mess with evolution, which is a fair argument.

Another side to that argument is that we already tamper with evolution in many a ways, one which is medicine, another which is wastage. A third which is chopping down rain forests and drilling mines, emptying the earth's natural reserves and transforming them into unnatural substances through synthetic processes.

It's not that I'm ignorant to evolution, but you or anyone else have not formulated a sound argument that has convinced me. That is why I tried to encourage you to respond with a more factually sourced and more explicitly stated opinion, and thus I suggested that your last post had none of those. I wasn't trying to say you lack intellect, I said your previous post didn't present any. It was very generalizing. In a sense, like you expected more from me, I didn't "expect" more from you, but I did want more. Too bad you took it as an insult, it wasn't intended as such.

I clearly stated that I'm not talking about moral. that would be moral. freedom and such things. But we talk about evolution. And I said that the problem is WHO sets the standard. You didn't understand that, even though you say

See. that's exactly what I was talking about. And that's what I meant by "if somebody fucks it up" we have a big problem. After 1000 years of wrong "breeding" it won't be enough to say, sorry, we made it wrong. There won't be humans left 2 explain it to.
there were experts that said something like this financial crises can not happen. we believed it. and than it did happen.
If we go back in time before the foundation of every law invented, you could apply that same argument. Just because something can go wrong is not a reason to not have a social discussion about it. Whether you believe a financial expert or not is up to you. Anyone who took it upon themselves to investigate how the monetary system works could predict that it was bound to happen, again and again. It will happen in the future as well. It's not a great comparison you are making. Anything can go wrong, even new technology like the LDR, or alternative fuels that may or may not affect the atmosphere in ways unknown to us. Like I said, just because something can go wrong is not a reason to not have a social discussion about it. Discussing things do not equal making them happen, and just as you think I'm wrong, maybe it's possible that you are wrong. Maybe someone out there could set a standard that would make you change your mind.

I'm not saying I am for or against. I am agreeing with good arguments for or against, as well as disagreeing with bad arguments for or against, and I am willing to hear everyone out. So far, in this thread, I've heard more arguments that I agree with on an emotional level, than bad arguments I disagree with. You are misplacing your anger, and you are wrong when you suggest I'm stupid or narrow-minded. Quite the opposite, I embrace all your stances on the subject, and more.


...and because these laws were invented by us they don't fail, are 100% correct and always made for the good of all people. Right? No law is corrupted by cooperations or the state, everything's perfect.
Which was my exact point. Let me ask you then, why do you put up with those systems that you already know are flawed? Why do you not do anything actively against them? I am not saying you are wrong not to, but I am asking you your personal reasons for not doing anything about the flawed systems around you that you currently put up with, if you care to share those.

In your country the birthrate isn't too high, it is somewhere else. So you suggest we don't allow africans to have children. Breeding without black blood, sounds like a great idea. The last idiot that dreamed of a superrace thankfully didn't succeed.
That is not what I tried to say at all, but I can tell you have a grim outlook on people. You are wrong and those kinds of implications don't sit well with me at all. I spoke as if this was to happen in Norway. I don't care two shits about Africa, they can make their own laws. I don't get what you are on about.

Why you're talking about you, your parents and the whore next to your door then? You're talking about individual experiences and base your opinion on your life. By your standards of breeding, the others are not allowed to have children. But what if other standards are applied. Sorry, you and your family just failed. Bye. (Why should we just decide that you are not allowed to have children? You waste our resources without any chance of good breeding, so why don't we go a step further and just eliminate you right away. You don't like that? Well, bad luck. Society decided differently but you understand that, right? After all you are for controlled breeding and you just happened to be on the wrong side of it)
Again with the pessimism. I am not speaking for me. If such a law came into place and it resulted in me not being allowed to have a baby, great! I guess I wasn't fit for it. I know I would make a great parent however, so that wouldn't happen, but I am willing to test that fate if it means children that could have had it bad ended up having better lives somehow. It's just a thought concept. You are seeing this way too black and white, and you are basically again just saying "well, what if the president suddenly decides to enslave the people? what if someone decides redheads don't deserve to live?" Well yeah, those things would be bad. Why aren't you at least trying to weight that against the good things that could come from it? I am a good person with good morals and a great respect for life, and people's right to freedom and individuality. I do however like to explore things intellectually. Why do you get so mad at someone for that and try to make them out as bad people who can't see their own madness? Do you see darkness all around you?
 

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