Who Believes The (72 Virgins In Paradise ?)

#1
If you ask a random person what they know about Islam, you will get some random responses. People generally know that Muslims worship Allah, but don't know much else. Plenty of people will venture incorrect guesses, like 'Islam is an Arab religion" or "Islam is only about Jihad" along with the mistaken idea that the word means Holy war. One of the more popular ideas that is now spreading is that "Terrorists are promised 72 virgin women when they die."

The "72 virgins" idea is probably the most overblown idea that people seem to remember about Islam. It's turning into a real stereotype. Forget the doctrines of monotheism and tolerance, it seems all people want to hear about is the virgins. There's a lot more to Paradise than just sex and physical pleasure, you know.

Before I go describing them in detail, I want to note that I'm taking the issue and the ayat (akin to verses) out of their proper context. One really should read the whole Surah (chapter) to get a better understanding of the religious signifigance. Nearly a third of the Qur'an talks about the life after this one, so while there are Surahs and chapters to describe the hereafter, I'm just discussing a few ayat which talk about the servants; a minor perk in the grand scheme of Paradise. Personally I think the greatest reward is to be in the presence of God Almighty. Plenty of non-Muslims take one of these single verses and generalize that all of heaven is lascivious, but that simply isn't the case. I'm just focusing on the virgins, since that's what you came here to read.

To start off, you need to understand what the rewards in Jannah (Paradise) are. The Quran says that those who do get into Paradise will be rewarded with blessings that eclipse anything on earth; unlimited food of your choice, riches, and wishes come true. Things considered sinful on Earth such as wine will be allowed, and people will be able to eat and drink all they want and not get full or hungover or sick. People will be reunited with their friends and relatives, we will all be made young again, and there will be no anger or pain. Everyone will be given palaces to live in, and clothing fit for royalty, with luxurious couches and thrones for everyone. There will be rivers of the purest water, milk, wine, and honey, all of which are better than any you will find on earth. Those who get to the highest part of Paradise, Jannah al-Firdaus, will also be able to see Allah with their own eyes. So, in a sense, Heaven is a paradise filled with pleasures. You need to imagine the context of when this idea of Paradise was revealed to the people; of the extremely stark and difficult life of ancient Bedouin Arabia. Something as simple as the constant flow of water in a stream was considered miraculous, so it would be natural to imagine heaven depicted this way, flowing with streams of water under the shade of huge trees. (Well what did you expect Paradise to be? Clouds, wings, and harps?)

Also, the believers who make it into Paradise, male and female, are promised beautiful companions, known as "Houris" in Arabic. The Quran describes them in some detail as such:

"Serving [the believers] will be immortal youths with jeweled and crystal cups filled with the purest wine which will neither give them headache nor hangover, with fruits and meats of their desire. They will be fair ones with lovely intense eyes like guarded pearls; A reward for the good deeds of their past life." (56:17-24)

"We have created mates for them and made them virgins, matched in age, for the companions of the right hand." (56:35-3

"They will be chaste, restraining their eyes in modesty, never touched by man or Jinn."(55:56)

"Serving them will be immortal servants. When you see them, they will look like scattered pearls." (76:19)

The Islamic scholar Yusuf Ali defines the word "Houris" in his english interpretation of Qur'an as "Youths of perpetual freshness." He also described them in his commentary: "The companionship of Beauty and Grace is one of the highest pleasures of life. In this bodily life it takes bodily form. In the higher life it takes a higher form...The pronoun in Arabic is in the feminine gender. It is made clear that these maidens for heavenly society will be of special creation,-of virginal purity, grace, and beauty, inspiring and inspired by love, with the question of time and age eliminated."

The Houris are basically creations of God, intelligent yet soulless and created to serve the believer who goes to Paradise. They are created for the purpose of serving the believer, and as such, they dont exactly have free will. They are described as pure, beautiful, lustrous, virgin, and more perfect than any human on earth. Imagine the woman of your dreams.

Women aren't left out: A man in paradise will get numerous female servants for himself, while a woman would get male servants. The Quran says that women shall be compensated just as well and says about the believers that "they" (the gender unspecified) shall have perfected mates/spouses as a reward of their deeds (2:25, 3:15, 4:57). So women will get the man of their dreams. Actually, even better than you could dream of.

In Paradise, you can marry them. You can interpret the "mates" as being spouses. Even if you were married on earth, they will be invisible to your spouse. Islam is pretty clear in saying that guiltless sex is a reward in Paradise. Since they are more like spouses, they will probably be given the status of one instead of a servant.

There is no direct evidence in the Qur'an to support there being 70 or 72 for each person. The numerical value of 70 is derived from a Quranic commentary by Quranic scholar Ibn Kathir. The number 72 comes from a hadith that says "'The smallest reward [each] for the people of Heaven is an abode where there are 80,000 servants and 72 wives, over which stands a dome decorated with pearls, aquamarine and ruby, as wide as the distance from [Damascus] to [Yemen].'"

Do Muslims believe it literally? Are they required to? This particular Hadith has technical weaknesses in its chain of transmitters and is therefore not considered 100% authenticly faultless, though it is listed in an authoritative collection. As a result, Muslims are not required to believe in it, though many inevitably do (but an even more respectable Hadith with virtually the same message can be found in a separate hadith collection). Most muslims believe that they will experience incredible physical pleasures when they enter heaven, and that you will be happier in heaven than you could possibly be in this life. Some say that the houris are a metaphor for the ineffable joys of the afterlife. "Ineffable" is the perfect word to describe it, since Allah promises rewards beyond imagination, meaning you can't even guess what reward lies ahead since there is no equal on Earth. Ergo, if you can imagine the greatest, richest, best thing in this life, then what will actually be there will be even better.

So, to answer the question "Do terrorists get 72 virgins in Paradise?" The Question is wrong. Anyone who gets into Heaven will get the servants, it's not specific to martyrs or the shaheeds. The more important question is, who is privileged to enter heaven according to Islam? That's a topic for another node.(Hint: Islam is unambiguous on the issue of suicide and hurting innocent people; they're Completely sinful) In case it's not clear to anyone, Terrorists who hurt innocent people are sinning, so it's up to Allah if they'll go to Paradise or not. You see, bad deeds aren't rewarded, only punished.

Sources:
The Qur'an
Islam Hijacked, by Professor Reuven Firestone
Islamic paradise replete with virgins.
 

Rukas

Capo Dei Capi
Staff member
#8
^^^ I bet the ladies love you... Oh wait, they dont have a choice do they? It's not like they can go out on their own or show their faces.
You're a neanderthal. Fuck off.
 

Stred

Stank ass bitch
Staff member
#9
so basically they spend their whole boring lives striving to be the best Muslim they can be, just so they can be chosen by Allah to enter paradise and have a soulless virgin waiting for them that no one else can see hmmm..

Although that endless stream of water sounds pretty intriguing ;)

lol what a joke I would rather live my life now and worry about getting fucked in the ass by Satin later
 

_carmi

me, myself & us
#10
So what is actually wrong with a virgin??

I Mean seriously, Which Man would pick You 'Carmi' Over a virgin??

Ponder on that you ugly, discusting...little girl.
what's wrong with not being a virgin? i thought i had banned you. guess i'll have to recheck that and make sure you don't come back. i'm thinking about a permanent ban now because you know, you don't sound like the type of person who changes and quite honestly you don't add much to the board.
 

_carmi

me, myself & us
#11
so basically they spend their whole boring lives striving to be the best Muslim they can be, just so they can be chosen by Allah to enter paradise and have a soulless virgin waiting for them that no one else can see hmmm..

Although that endless stream of water sounds pretty intriguing ;)

lol what a joke I would rather live my life now and worry about getting fucked in the ass by Satin later
Yeah Satin's a real bad ass.
 

Flipmo

VIP Member
Staff member
#12
Don't you both mean Satan? lol.

As a side note, I'd take Carmi over a virgin anyday - virgins are boring and lost in bed, and Carmi is probably not... I mean that in the most respectful way also, even though it sounds bad lol...
 

Duke

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#14
^ Good question, what about them?

I mean, you don't have to like them. You don't even have to pretend you respect them imo. But lynching goes a bit too far....
 

Preach

Well-Known Member
#16
"They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes"
- Revelation chapter 7, verses 16, 17

"In My Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you"
- John chapter 14, verse 2).

"No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him"
- Corinth chapter 2, verse 9



It's the same way the bible describes heaven, or maybe in more depth. It's the same message. Wealth, pleasure, better than anything you can imagine on Earth. We don't need to look to Islam to find crazy. As long as Scientology and any other religion is officially condoned in the Western world, I really question anybody with an opinion that starts with "muslims should..." or "Islam should..." A lot of people seem to think that just because you are an individual, your opinion will be associated with you. You forget that people don't know everything about you when you utter these kinds of opinions. They don't necessarily know that you are a good person who means no harm and intends to do good. So when people are being all righteous like "Oh, yeah, it's really bad the way muslims treat women" you have to remember that if a muslim hears you saying it, they associate your opinion with the world you come from, not the individual that utters it. Our world is no better than theirs, it's just bad in different ways. They beat women, we slaughter cows en masse. They allow sex with young girls, we throw people who pay for sex in jail... unless they video tape it and release it to DVD.

Sure, one can say that having sex with a 9 year old girl some two thousand years ago or marrying a 14 year old girl today is more morally wrong, or causes more harm to a person, than does paying for sex and potentially contributing to human trafficking. It's pretty irrelevant to make comparisons, the only thing noteworthy in this context is that our two societies are vastly different; and have been for several thousand years. The wrongs in our society are as absurd to them as the wrongs in their society are to us. To think that we are better than them is a form of elitism that is akin to racism. It is a selfish and evil outlook. We have more resources and better technology, but the concepts of good and bad are timeless and certainly have nothing to do with resources and technology. So no, it would be unreal to think that we are better than them. Yet this is the impression we give off with our criticism of everything they do, our interference in their politics, our occupation of their land, our exploits and breaches of human rights. Our warmongering and our need for more resources. From a philosophical, moral, or objective point of view our society did not take a "better" way than the world of Islam. We only went "different" ways. And now we are waging war on the region, trying to force our ways onto them, like the holy crusaders did some hundred years ago. History repeats itself, yet we find it in our place to criticise their ways. I lol hard.
 

_carmi

me, myself & us
#17
Don't you both mean Satan? lol.

As a side note, I'd take Carmi over a virgin anyday - virgins are boring and lost in bed, and Carmi is probably not... I mean that in the most respectful way also, even though it sounds bad lol...
Yeah that's why I quoted him.

And yeah... no matter how you say this it sounds bad.
And what about gay muslims?
Aren't gays considered evil, disgraceful? I doubt they even get a place in Heaven.
 

Duke

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#18
"They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes"
- Revelation chapter 7, verses 16, 17

"In My Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you"
- John chapter 14, verse 2).

"No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him"
- Corinth chapter 2, verse 9



It's the same way the bible describes heaven, or maybe in more depth. It's the same message. Wealth, pleasure, better than anything you can imagine on Earth. We don't need to look to Islam to find crazy. As long as Scientology and any other religion is officially condoned in the Western world, I really question anybody with an opinion that starts with "muslims should..." or "Islam should..." A lot of people seem to think that just because you are an individual, your opinion will be associated with you. You forget that people don't know everything about you when you utter these kinds of opinions. They don't necessarily know that you are a good person who means no harm and intends to do good. So when people are being all righteous like "Oh, yeah, it's really bad the way muslims treat women" you have to remember that if a muslim hears you saying it, they associate your opinion with the world you come from, not the individual that utters it. Our world is no better than theirs, it's just bad in different ways. They beat women, we slaughter cows en masse. They allow sex with young girls, we throw people who pay for sex in jail... unless they video tape it and release it to DVD.

Sure, one can say that having sex with a 9 year old girl some two thousand years ago or marrying a 14 year old girl today is more morally wrong, or causes more harm to a person, than does paying for sex and potentially contributing to human trafficking. It's pretty irrelevant to make comparisons, the only thing noteworthy in this context is that our two societies are vastly different; and have been for several thousand years. The wrongs in our society are as absurd to them as the wrongs in their society are to us. To think that we are better than them is a form of elitism that is akin to racism. It is a selfish and evil outlook. We have more resources and better technology, but the concepts of good and bad are timeless and certainly have nothing to do with resources and technology. So no, it would be unreal to think that we are better than them. Yet this is the impression we give off with our criticism of everything they do, our interference in their politics, our occupation of their land, our exploits and breaches of human rights. Our warmongering and our need for more resources. From a philosophical, moral, or objective point of view our society did not take a "better" way than the world of Islam. We only went "different" ways. And now we are waging war on the region, trying to force our ways onto them, like the holy crusaders did some hundred years ago. History repeats itself, yet we find it in our place to criticise their ways. I lol hard.

You raise a few VERY good points which i'd love to debate, but online makes it fuck-off difficult and also im drunk and stoned right now and can't put in a reply. But hit me up on MSN or maybe i'll feel the urge to elaborate in this thread in the near future. I have a very very interesting topic to raise, which is that I think in pure basic principal, i DO believe that our society is superior to the middle eastern culture. Thats the bottomline but we should really find a better time and place to get into this.
 

S O F I

Administrator
Staff member
#20
You raise a few VERY good points which i'd love to debate, but online makes it fuck-off difficult and also im drunk and stoned right now and can't put in a reply. But hit me up on MSN or maybe i'll feel the urge to elaborate in this thread in the near future. I have a very very interesting topic to raise, which is that I think in pure basic principal, i DO believe that our society is superior to the middle eastern culture. Thats the bottomline but we should really find a better time and place to get into this.
I'd be interested in your view and how you back it up so please do post the MSN conversation you have with Preach in this thread.
 

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