Did the Chinese discover America?

PuffnScruff

Well-Known Member
#1
this is pretty interesting
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4609074.stm
A map due to be unveiled in Beijing and London next week may lend weight to a theory a Chinese admiral discovered America before Christopher Columbus.
The map, which shows North and South America, apparently states that it is a 1763 copy of another map made in 1418.

If true, it could imply Chinese mariners discovered and mapped America decades before Columbus' 1492 arrival.

The map, which is being dated to check it was made in 1763, faces a lot of scepticism from experts.

Chinese characters written beside the map say it was drawn by Mo Yi Tong and copied from a map made in the 16th year of the Emperor Yongle, or 1418.

It clearly shows Africa and Australia.

The British Isles, however, are not marked.

Controversial claim

The map was bought for about $500 from a Shanghai dealer in 2001 by a Chinese lawyer and collector, Liu Gang.

According to the Economist magazine, Mr Liu only became aware of the map's potential significance after he read a book by British author Gavin Menzies.

The book, 1421: The Year China discovered the World, made the controversial claim that a Chinese admiral and eunuch, Zheng He, sailed around the world and discovered America on the way.

Zheng He, a Muslim mariner and explorer, is widely thought to have sailed around South East Asia and India, but the claim he visited America is hotly disputed.

The map is now being tested to check the age of its paper and ink, with the results due to be known in February.

Even if it does prove to have been drawn in 1763, sceptics will point out that we still only have the mapmaker's word that he copied if from a 1418 map, rather than from a more recent one.

check out this map, i wonder what happend to that island off the coast of cali?
 

Diaz

New Member
#2
PuffnScruff said:
check out this map, i wonder what happend to that island off the coast of cali?
lol Good question. Even though it wasnt a question, it was just a statement with a question mark at the end.
 

Glockmatic

Well-Known Member
#3
I saw this earlier, very interesting stuff. The vikings visited North America before any other civilization (other than the natives), but they didn't explore it at all. But how could the chinese explore 2 more continents without leaving anything behind? Maybe some settlements or cultural gifts to the natives?
 
#6
I believe the ancient Siberians from Asia discovered America when they were migrating during the last ice age. :thumb: 12,000 years ago. And greezi's right, Amerindians have Asian features because of this.
 

PuffnScruff

Well-Known Member
#7
sorry i pulled a cnn with my title, or should i say headline...:D

what i should have wrote was something like "did the chinese discover america before columbus"
 

Duke

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#8
If that map is real, then yes, obviously the Chinese knew a lot more about the Americas than the Europeans.

But the whole principle of the "discovery" is a bit vague here. The first humans to discover it were of course the people that have lived there all the bloody time.

critikaldesignz said:
I believe the ancient Siberians from Asia discovered America when they were migrating during the last ice age. :thumb: 12,000 years ago. And greezi's right, Amerindians have Asian features because of this.
Yes, but would you regard this as a "discovery"?

Who were the first non-Americans that discovered the continent(s)? The Vikings found the eastern shores of Canada about 1000 years ago. Columbus hit the Caribean in 1492.

And now, how do the Chinese fit into this?
 
#12
Aristotle said:
1421 - The Year China Discovered the World.
Great book. Check it out.
I've been meaning to read that book for a while now. First year history at uni we were taught a little bit about Zheng He, mostly about the extraordinary technology used to built the ships and their sheer size and capability in comparison to that of the europeans.

And yeah, I think it's becoming more widely acknowledged that China was aware of Australia although didn't bother with it... guess it was only fit for English rejects and Aboriginal-murdering bruts.
 
#13
plenty of people VISITED north america before columbus did

the only difference between the africans, chinese and vikings that visited north america before columbus is that they didnt bring disease, murder villages and blood lines and take over the land and spit in their face then going on to keep them fenced in on "reserves"
 

ARon

Well-Known Member
#14
Amara said:
I've been meaning to read that book for a while now. First year history at uni we were taught a little bit about Zheng He, mostly about the extraordinary technology used to built the ships and their sheer size and capability in comparison to that of the europeans.

And yeah, I think it's becoming more widely acknowledged that China was aware of Australia although didn't bother with it... guess it was only fit for English rejects and Aboriginal-murdering bruts.
It has been a while but I think it was cus the land wasn't good enough or something. It was so dry it wasn't worth it I guess to go and settle the land. I always had a lot of respect for the Chinese culture and what they've done for culture, science etc., but the book will blow you away, they are amazing people.

Too Legit Too Legit to Quit, haha nice.
 
#15
a lot of civilisations such as the vikings, were aware of the presence of the America's before Colombus.

Actually, i think Colombus himself used maps from China, maps he found in rome, showing a land west of europe, to convince people to join him.

there are also phoenician and anciant egyptian maps showing similar land to the west, so the debate about who discovered America first can go on 4ever
 

Duke

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#17
Khaled said:
Actually, i think Colombus himself used maps from China, maps he found in rome, showing a land west of europe, to convince people to join him.

Ol' Christoffel was looking for a western route to India, man. He wasn't on a field trip. He thought he hit India. Where you think the term Indians comes from?
 
#18
Duke said:
Ol' Christoffel was looking for a western route to India, man. He wasn't on a field trip. He thought he hit India. Where you think the term Indians comes from?
no shit :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

and why did he think the world is round? did he came up with it himself.

Colombus did see a lot of maps showing a land to the west he assumed were the lands visited by Marco polo.
he also used the maps arguments to convince his crew and to gain support for his expedition.
 

The.Menace

Well-Known Member
Staff member
#19
he vikings visited North America before any other civilization (other than the natives)
exactly, therefor I don't understand what the big deal about those chinese here is. Al lcredit goes 2 the vikings.

peace
 
#20
Khaled said:
he also used the maps arguments to convince his crew and to gain support for his expedition.
His arguments were wrong, though. He tried to convince people not of the shape of the earth, but of the circumference and thus the distance from Europe to Asia. Had America not got in his way, he and his crew would have died before reaching India.
 

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