NMD - Cold War Continues

#1
"Rude awakening to missile-defense dream"
January 04, 2005 edition
By Scott Ritter

DELMAR, N.Y.

....When President Bush came to power in 2001, there was a dramatic change in posture regarding ballistic missile defense. The administration announced it was withdrawing from the Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty, clearing away development and operational constraints. At the same time, the administration laid out a comprehensive plan that envisioned a layered missile-defense system. After studying the SS-25 missile for years, the US military believed it finally had a solution in the form of a multitiered antiballistic missile system that focused on boost-phase intercept (firing antimissile missiles that would home in on an ICBM shortly after launch), space-based laser systems designed to knock out a missile in flight, and terminal missile intercept systems, which would destroy a missile as it reentered the earth's atmosphere.

The NMD system being fielded to counter the SS-25, and any similar or less sophisticated threats that may emerge from China, Iran, North Korea, and elsewhere, will probably have cumulative costs between $800 billion and $1.2 trillion by the time it reaches completion in 2015.

However, the Bush administration's dream of a viable NMD has been rendered fantasy by the Russian test of the SS-27 Topol-M. According to the Russians, the Topol-M has high-speed solid-fuel boosters that rapidly lift the missile into the atmosphere, making boost-phase interception impossible unless one is located practically next door to the launcher. The SS-27 has been hardened against laser weapons and has a highly maneuverable post-boost vehicle that can defeat any intercept capability as it dispenses up to three warheads and four sophisticated decoys.

To counter the SS-27 threat, the US will need to start from scratch. And even if a viable defense could be mustered, by that time the Russians may have fielded an even more sophisticated missile, remaining one step ahead of any US countermeasures. The US cannot afford to spend billions of dollars on a missile-defense system that will never achieve the level of defense envisioned. The Bush administration's embrace of technology, and rejection of diplomacy, when it comes to arms control has failed.

If America continues down the current path of trying to field a viable missile-defense system, significant cuts will need to be made in other areas of the defense budget, or funds reallocated from other nonmilitary spending programs. With America already engaged in a costly war in Iraq, and with the possibility of additional conflict with Iran, Syria, or North Korea looming on the horizon, funding a missile-defense system that not only does not work as designed, but even if it did, would not be capable of defending America from threats such as the Topol-M missile, makes no sense.

The Bush administration would do well to reconsider its commitment to a national missile-defense system, and instead reengage in the kind of treaty-based diplomacy that in the past produced arms control results that were both real and lasting. This would not only save billions, it would make America, and the world, a safer place.

• Scott Ritter is a former intelligence officer and weapons inspector in the Soviet Union (1988-1990) and Iraq (1991-1998). He is author of 'Frontier Justice: Weapons of Mass Destruction and the Bushwhacking of America

http://www.gyre.org/
 
#3
Cown said:
Fucking idiots! The Bush administration is doing everything to start war! It's sickening... damn fools
But what bothers me is that the whole situation is so predictable... I mean the US established this plan of National Missile Defence in order to counter the threats from abroad, meanwhile it maintains the strongest nuclear arsenal in addition to having the strongest economy and military. Surely there are no threats imminent or rather, strong enough to warrant the acquisition of more WMD. So, really, what do they expect - that states such as Russia, North Korea, Iran, Syria etc who see this as a direct threat to their security, will stand back and let the US gain greater control and potentially direct all international affairs....I don't think so. MORE WMD LEADS TO MORE INSECURITY WHICH LEADS TO GREATER GLOBAL PROLIFERATION (the one thing that the US is trying to counter!!).... you're right Cown, they are fucking idiots...there's no other way to describe it!
 

groobz

New Member
#4
Hey Amara, i guess america shouldn't bother with all these defence systems eh? i mean these northkoreans, chinese, iranians ect seem quite normal to you right?

oh and amara, racist austraila donated 1billion + all the services to the indonesians after the tsunami,, is that good enough for you? or are we racist and did all this because of international pressure? haha
 

Glockmatic

Well-Known Member
#5
The defence system would NEVER work, it didn't work against a single missle, how would it work with hundreds of missles with a thousand decoys? Its just a symbol to make people think they're safe from outside threats.
 

Rukas

Capo Dei Capi
Staff member
#6
groobz said:
Hey Amara, i guess america shouldn't bother with all these defence systems eh? i mean these northkoreans, chinese, iranians ect seem quite normal to you right?

oh and amara, racist austraila donated 1billion + all the services to the indonesians after the tsunami,, is that good enough for you? or are we racist and did all this because of international pressure? haha

Groobz, you're all fun and games in Thugz Mansion and on Yahoo and all that, but stay out of Words of Wisdom because comments like that show that you have no grasp of what is being discussed. That has to be one of the dumbest most self serving posts I have ever seen.

She never said any of what you just suggested, and for you to bring in other factors that you will continue to disagree on and fight over plainly shows that you are simply not intelligent enough to debate the topic at hand, but instead of shutting up about it or admitting your short comings you decide to draw further attention towards you and topics you are stubborn about and versed in, and draw attention away from what the discussion is about.

If you didnt annoy me so much Id laugh my ass off. Seriously.


Now, for all of you whom actually know what the fuck they are talking about; the NMD was always a stupid idea if you ask me, its just too expensive and doesnt weild the results to justify it, especially considering America's debt situation.

Not only does it not work against these new missles, by the time its finished in 2015 I doubt it will work against a whole range of missles. Furthermore, how much of a risk are foreign missles any way? With America controlling so many nukes they have a natrual deterent anyway. Their biggest worries, as shown in 2001, are small ground based nukes being smuggled in and other "terrorist" or guriella warfare tactics. Using their own systems against them, whether airlines or the massive shipping trade to bring in nukes or other weapons. Or simple building bombs at home. None of the US casualties on their own soil have been caused by military weapons or missiles, they have been caused by bombs and maniplulation of their own system.

Basically this whole defense system is a shroud to hide the truth, much like the Star Wars program was. Its a means to cypher tax payer money into military projects to develop technology that can then be sold back to the tax payer. Thats all Star Wars was, and I wish this was the same but i fear its more sinister then that. SW was never really fully developed, but this seems like it will be. These so called anti missiles are just missiles, they are weapons. This NMD gives America the freedom to make more missiles and call them a defense system. Not to mention lasers from out of space? Come on, what stops America from using those lasers to target other things apart from missiles? Nothing.

The simple fact of the matter is, if America had went out and said, "we are going to develop a new weapon with lasers on US satelites in space that can not be defended against and can target around the world," everyone would be up in arms about it. But now its a defense thing, America is defending themselves and all of a sudden its alright, meanwhile missiles have never been used against them.

All the NMD is is one big weapon, which no other country will be able to defend against or match. It will totally shift the balance of power towards America. If other countries cant deter America with the threat of their nukes because America can just blow them up before they reach US soil, yet at the same time America has their nukes and this new laser system toy to use against them, America all of a sudden has military control over the whole globe.

And if any of you, groobz Im looking at you, think that is a good thing, put a gun to your head now and pull the trigger.
 

groobz

New Member
#7
Rukas said:
Groobz, you're all fun and games in Thugz Mansion and on Yahoo and all that, but stay out of Words of Wisdom because comments like that show that you have no grasp of what is being discussed. That has to be one of the dumbest most self serving posts I have ever seen.

She never said any of what you just suggested, and for you to bring in other factors that you will continue to disagree on and fight over plainly shows that you are simply not intelligent enough to debate the topic at hand, but instead of shutting up about it or admitting your short comings you decide to draw further attention towards you and topics you are stubborn about and versed in, and draw attention away from what the discussion is about.

If you didnt annoy me so much Id laugh my ass off. Seriously.


Now, for all of you whom actually know what the fuck they are talking about; the NMD was always a stupid idea if you ask me, its just too expensive and doesnt weild the results to justify it, especially considering America's debt situation.

Not only does it not work against these new missles, by the time its finished in 2015 I doubt it will work against a whole range of missles. Furthermore, how much of a risk are foreign missles any way? With America controlling so many nukes they have a natrual deterent anyway. Their biggest worries, as shown in 2001, are small ground based nukes being smuggled in and other "terrorist" or guriella warfare tactics. Using their own systems against them, whether airlines or the massive shipping trade to bring in nukes or other weapons. Or simple building bombs at home. None of the US casualties on their own soil have been caused by military weapons or missiles, they have been caused by bombs and maniplulation of their own system.

Basically this whole defense system is a shroud to hide the truth, much like the Star Wars program was. Its a means to cypher tax payer money into military projects to develop technology that can then be sold back to the tax payer. Thats all Star Wars was, and I wish this was the same but i fear its more sinister then that. SW was never really fully developed, but this seems like it will be. These so called anti missiles are just missiles, they are weapons. This NMD gives America the freedom to make more missiles and call them a defense system. Not to mention lasers from out of space? Come on, what stops America from using those lasers to target other things apart from missiles? Nothing.

The simple fact of the matter is, if America had went out and said, "we are going to develop a new weapon with lasers on US satelites in space that can not be defended against and can target around the world," everyone would be up in arms about it. But now its a defense thing, America is defending themselves and all of a sudden its alright, meanwhile missiles have never been used against them.

All the NMD is is one big weapon, which no other country will be able to defend against or match. It will totally shift the balance of power towards America. If other countries cant deter America with the threat of their nukes because America can just blow them up before they reach US soil, yet at the same time America has their nukes and this new laser system toy to use against them, America all of a sudden has military control over the whole globe.

And if any of you, groobz Im looking at you, think that is a good thing, put a gun to your head now and pull the trigger.
Rukas, i know you will take amara's side most of the time because you too see eye to eye. I simply made that remark so Amara could wake up to herself and see the genorosity of aussies, don't forget this was the same Amara that said austraila has racist migration policies which in itself is laughable.

and how could my post of been self centered when i was asking HER questions? anyway maybe your right, i need to take a break from this section.
 

Rukas

Capo Dei Capi
Staff member
#8
groobz said:
Rukas, i know you will take amara's side most of the time because you too see eye to eye. I simply made that remark so Amara could wake up to herself and see the genorosity of aussies, don't forget this was the same Amara that said austraila has racist migration policies which in itself is laughable.

and how could my post of been self centered when i was asking HER questions? anyway maybe your right, i need to take a break from this section.

Your post was self centered because it was an attempt to include yourself in a thread and conversation you had no other part in.

As for your statement I could disprove it but I dont want to get into it with you. Lets just say that Australia's actions were political, and in any regard they donated to a foreign country. Those people are not imigrants, our discussion was always based on imigrants, people coming here, those people are not imigrants. We never said some Australians hated all races, just imigrants, and those people are not imigrants, if you cant see the difference then oh well. But i dont want to take this thread off course.
 

Cown

Active Member
#9
Amara said:
But what bothers me is that the whole situation is so predictable... I mean the US established this plan of National Missile Defence in order to counter the threats from abroad, meanwhile it maintains the strongest nuclear arsenal in addition to having the strongest economy and military. Surely there are no threats imminent or rather, strong enough to warrant the acquisition of more WMD. So, really, what do they expect - that states such as Russia, North Korea, Iran, Syria etc who see this as a direct threat to their security, will stand back and let the US gain greater control and potentially direct all international affairs....I don't think so. MORE WMD LEADS TO MORE INSECURITY WHICH LEADS TO GREATER GLOBAL PROLIFERATION (the one thing that the US is trying to counter!!).... you're right Cown, they are fucking idiots...there's no other way to describe it!
:thumb: exactly
 
#10
Rukas said:
Your post was self centered because it was an attempt to include yourself in a thread and conversation you had no other part in.

As for your statement I could disprove it but I dont want to get into it with you. Lets just say that Australia's actions were political, and in any regard they donated to a foreign country. Those people are not imigrants, our discussion was always based on imigrants, people coming here, those people are not imigrants. We never said some Australians hated all races, just imigrants, and those people are not imigrants, if you cant see the difference then oh well. But i dont want to take this thread off course.
attempt to include myself in a thread i had no part in? lol, your the one who tried to bring yourself into something that had nothing to do with YOU!! so how about u keep your mouth shut and don't attack me of shit that u just did. and yeah keep talking about proving me wrong, i guess thats why you and amara had to leave the conversation when me and realmatic had put our points down. oh well, you were the one telling me that no one should vote for howard, how is latham looking now? lol see what i mean mate? thank god we live in a democracy where majority rules. I could go on, but i've had a few and i'm kinda angry right now, so just ignore me
 

Rukas

Capo Dei Capi
Staff member
#11
groobz said:
attempt to include myself in a thread i had no part in? lol, your the one who tried to bring yourself into something that had nothing to do with YOU!! so how about u keep your mouth shut and don't attack me of shit that u just did. and yeah keep talking about proving me wrong, i guess thats why you and amara had to leave the conversation when me and realmatic had put our points down. oh well, you were the one telling me that no one should vote for howard, how is latham looking now? lol see what i mean mate? thank god we live in a democracy where majority rules. I could go on, but i've had a few and i'm kinda angry right now, so just ignore me

Believe me, I intend to ignore you. And we didnt leave any discussion, we said what we had to say and got sick of talking to brick walls.

Lets get on with the topic at hand, which has nothing to do with groobz or anything he has said.

Any further bullshit by your groobz, or anyone for that matter, that is offtopic and stupid, will be deleted and dealt with.
 
#12
Rukas said:
Believe me, I intend to ignore you. And we didnt leave any discussion, we said what we had to say and got sick of talking to brick walls.

Lets get on with the topic at hand, which has nothing to do with groobz or anything he has said.

Any further bullshit by your groobz, or anyone for that matter, that is offtopic and stupid, will be deleted and dealt with.
yeah u intended to ignore me, but couldn't help it, u just had to bring yourself in, and believe me i had to say things like 6times to you guys in the other thread, so if i'm a brick wall, u guys must be a solid reenforced iron wall. anyway i want to talk to u about the legal prob u're having, let me know what i can do,, delete this after you've read if ya want
 

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