National self-determinaton - solution to Iraq?

[S O F I]

So, some political scientist in the US, the name escaped me, proposed a solution to Iraq. In a nutshell, the Kurds(although they kind of do already) would have their own state, the Sunnis would have their own state, and the Shiites would have their own state. Now, of course, it's easier said than done but apparently his plan went in-depth, apparently. What do you guys think?

 

[PuffnScruff]

i dont agree with it. it's not a solution for iraq and it's not going to help the people of iraq out if they are seperated into different sections. the main reason i dont like the idea is because of iran. we have already seen, especially in the past few weeks alone, that iran is funding militant groups, giving them money, weapons, their own soldiers to fight against us and the iraqi govt. iran would not waste time to get in there and take over all three sections one by one. iran is already waiting for us to leave so they can get in there which would just make things worse than they are now and we would be right back in iraq. saudi arabia, egypt,and jordan recently came together and agreed that iran is the biggest thread to the middle east right now. they dont like that the u.s. is in iraq and they dont want us there either. but they really dont want to see iran take over.

the only solution that i see for iraq is for the iraqi govt to let our troops do their job and for the iraqi people to do something. 300,000 plus iraqi troops and they do what exactly? iraqi govt wont let us go and get al-Sadr because why? maybe if Maliki would keep some of his promises things would be different. i just hope he lives up to his word this time when he said he is taking the cuffs off our troops and let them do their job.

 

[ARon]

Isn't just the idea of that a contradiction to "freedom" and "our way of life." I dont see how seperatism would solve anything.

 

[S O F I]

Isn't just the idea of that a contradiction to "freedom" and "our way of life."

Not at all. I would also like to mention that the "Western" way of life is not the "right" way of life or the "universal" way of life.

I dont see how separatism would solve anything.

It could relieve internal tensions in Iraq which are creating a civil war type of situation.

 

[Morris]

Now, of course, it's easier said than done but apparently his plan went in-depth, apparently. What do you guys think?

It'd be a good idea, but there are a couple of serious problems:

#1 - Dividing up oil revenues is already undermining one national government. Imagine 3 different countries and 3 different governments, all of whom detest each other, trying to reach an agreement.

#2 - It's not likely that any of the governments would muzzle their militias. You'd simply turn a civil war into war between a few nations.

#3 - If you split them up into 3 governments, that's at least 2 potentially hostile governments to the West. The Sunnis would probably harbor Al Qaeda in Iraq type groups, while the Shiites would harbor al-Sadr types with ties to Iran. That's not exactly ideal for the West. And the Kurds aren't perfect angels either.

 

[ARon]

Not at all. I would also like to mention that the "Western" way of life is not the "right" way of life or the "universal" way of life.



It could relieve internal tensions in Iraq which are creating a civil war type of situation.

I'm not saying the "Western" way of life is the "right" way of life, more like that is why we are there, to bring them democracy and peace. So how would seperating three groups and making invisible lines stop internal tension. It's not like they would stop just cus they have their own state now.

 

[S O F I]

more like that is why we are there, to bring them democracy and peace.

so the liberals say.

hmm.

 

[Jokerman]

It doesn't matter what we think or want. It's not a good solution, but it's inevitable and it's what at least 80% of the Iraqi people want. Iraq was only kept together by Sunni force. Once we dissolved their power, Iraq's fate was sealed. The US cannot put the country back together again. The Kurds do not want to be part of Iraq. They already have a Regional Government and security force. Kurdistan's full independence is just a matter of time.

The Sunnis and Shiites will never get along and civil war is inevitable. The best we can hope to do is try to contain the civil war by helping each group develop their own government and security forces. That might bring some stability to Iraq so we can withdraw our forces. Of course, Bush & Co doesn't want to hear it: "I got a man!" "I ain't tryin' to hear that, see," until we and the Iraqis lose many more people and the Democrats finally pull the plug on Bush and drag him kicking and screaming out of there.

And then we can listen to Bush and Sean Hannity tell us the resultant bloodshed was due to our withdrawal, rather than from us having gone in there and making a mess in the first place. In fact, Bush's only hope to lay the blame on someone else for the mess he created is if we leave.

 

[Khaled]

It would never work, you cannot manipulate demographics like that. Sunnis and Shias are not living in seperate areas, although some regions are predominantly sunnis, and others Shias, but you cannot seperate them into different geographical parts.

the partition plan has been tried in lebanon, it has been tried in Palestine, and it failed miserably in both cases.

I can't believe im saying this but the the US are in too deep to quit now. withdrawing us troops would be the worst possible mistake at this point (an open invitation for Iran to take full control).

what lacks in Iran is a clear strategy fo the US, cuz i don't really see what they are trying to do (unless they are encouraging a civil war...)
If the aim is to counter Iran expansion, they have to ally with the sunnis.
If the aim is to secure Iraq, than ally with Shias

If the aim is democracy.. tough luck, too late for that. Should have thought about that earlier

 

[Morris]

If the aim is to counter Iran expansion, they have to ally with the sunnis.
If the aim is to secure Iraq, than ally with Shias

One of the problems is that both of those are American goals